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Let's talk about Waterless Coolant

gazzo

AMC Jeep nutjob
Lifetime Member
City
Fremantle
State
WA
So I'm hearing more and more about waterless coolant. Now I have two AMC 360s in my precious Heeps with those even more precious timing gears covers. They are oil on one side and coolant on the other as you know and that horrible skinny area around the port that goes through to the engine. When I changed the water pump on Farmtruk a few weeks ago I already had some pitting even though I have had fresh green in there since I built the engine.
So here I am considering switching to "waterless coolant" and want to know if y'all have had any experience, good or bad.
Apparently you circulate some preflush product through for a while, even up to possibly four weeks, to absorb any and all H2O before you load the new stuff.
Another interesting thing about it is as there is no water there's no steam and therefore no expansion and most importantly no pressure which can only be a good thing.
Bring us your wisdom folks.....
 

barrys

Scrambler Junkie
Lifetime Member
City
East Norriton
State
PA
I had never heard of it. Sounds interesting, and expensive. Probably not good for a trail rig as if you get a hole in a hose, you are out of luck, can't top it off with other people's coolant, stream/river water, etc.

Sent from my SM-J320P
 

gazzo

AMC Jeep nutjob
Lifetime Member
City
Fremantle
State
WA
I had never heard of it. Sounds interesting, and expensive. Probably not good for a trail rig as if you get a hole in a hose, you are out of luck, can't top it off with other people's coolant, stream/river water, etc.

Sent from my SM-J320P

You're right but I think the chance of holes is low due to no pressure.
 

MrBeep

CJ-8 Vendor Supporter
Member
SOA Member
CJ-8.com Vendor
City
Dillsboro
State
IN
I've run it in several high dollar "Race Engines" in the past and had no problems with it at all. It also is more efficient at cooling and on both engines, 16.5 to 1 compression, engine temps dropped 20 degrees at Finnish line. :wave:
 

cdvcj8

It's Not My Scrambler
Lifetime Member
City
West Friendship
State
MD
Ed used it once on an episode of Wheeler Dealers. I was wondering if it was starting to catch on or not. [emoji897]


 

MrBeep

CJ-8 Vendor Supporter
Member
SOA Member
CJ-8.com Vendor
City
Dillsboro
State
IN
It is used in competitive engines because of its superb cooling capabilities and if a head gasket leaks or it mixes with the oil it isn't quite as hard on bearings on expensive crankshafts and connecting rods.


 

gazzo

AMC Jeep nutjob
Lifetime Member
City
Fremantle
State
WA
Ed used it once on an episode of Wheeler Dealers. I was wondering if it was starting to catch on or not. [emoji897]

I've seen ads here for Evans Waterless Coolants and then saw the episode you mentioned. That's why I asked here but it seems to not have the foothold I think it deserves. Curious. They say it's about £90 plus the water scavenger but if it saves an engine it would be money well spent I reckon.
 

hefavitzen

Scrambler Junkie
BENEFACTOR
Gold Member
Lifetime Member
City
Rock Hill
State
SC
I'll try this and let you know! Give me a month.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A
 

generalgrant

Basic User
City
Commerce Township
State
MI
I had Evans in my plane. The up side is higher boiling point which translates into lower pressure. Proleg is that without water it runs hotter. I've been back and forth between the green and Evans and what I figured out is Evans is great for bikes and race planes, but for a jeep just stick to the green and refresh it every two years. Also, if you need extra coolant, no one stocks Evans. As soon as you taint it with water or any thing else to get home you need to flush the system and use a fresh batch.


1981 CJ8 Scrambler
2016 Wrangler Unlimited
2003 Midget Mustang M1
 

bigwalton

Alaskan Postal nutjob
FORUM MANAGER
SOA Member
City
Dexter
State
MI
Hadn't seen this thread. I talked at length with the Evans folks at EJS this year, they're looking to make a significant push into the Jeep market.

I was fascinated as I'd never heard of it and I have to admit that I'd never thought about what leads to the pressure in the coolant system, though it may seem obvious. They would argue that it actually cools better than 50/50 because when the water does boil in 50/50 it's in the very hottest parts of the engine and creates air pockets that prevent coolant from contacting that metal and doing it's job. So when you eliminate any boiling anywhere in the engine, everything is always getting cooled.

I immediately saw the potential downside that folks have mentioned in that you're going to be on your own with any repair/refill on the trail, but once you go to this setup, the only pressure that you see is whatever the water pump puts out, which is trivial compared to a hot 50/50 system. So starting with new hoses and possibly radiator when going waterless could theoretically be a forever fix for your coolant barring a mechanical failure taking out something a stick through the radiator, etc.

So, with all of that said, I worked out a piece for JPFreek (http://currentissue.jpfreek.com) with them to test Evans' stuff out and none other than our own Bad Karma is dropping it into his Scrambler along with some other fun bits to try to finally fix the cooling (and fan) issues that have been hitting his LS swapped rig. :bacon:

The initial piece will be in my next issue (Fall) and I expect to do a long-term update on it maybe next year. :thumbsup:
 

gazzo

AMC Jeep nutjob
Lifetime Member
City
Fremantle
State
WA
There you go. I will be watching with interest. I have picked up an old non-jeep vehicle and snd rebuilding the coolant side of things. I will be trialling the Evans action on this.
 

mysunnshine

Legacy Registered User
City
Phoenix
State
AZ
I have a hard time justifying using the waterless coolant. In most cases, there is a solution without using that stuff. Using the correct cooling fan, radiator volume/size, and tune are very important parts to heating issues. With Jeeps specifically, it's hard to expect a radiator that the core is 18X18(324 sq/in) to cool 400hp. Then add on top of that it's not getting full airflow because of the grill slats(6 at 1X15 90sq/in), and now you have a relatively small opening trying to exchange the heat. Now take into account high external temperatures and humidity levels, you are over the edge.
 

bigwalton

Alaskan Postal nutjob
FORUM MANAGER
SOA Member
City
Dexter
State
MI
Not going to disagree with that and Mike is doing this at the same time as an aluminum radiator and new fan setup. This is where it makes the most sense to me, when you go for a cooling system upgrade like a new radiator and you are going for the "forever fix" to make the new stuff last (theoretically) for the life of the Jeep.

A big part of that is corrosion and the Evans stuff won't affect either an iron block or aluminum radiators/heads/blocks. The Evans folks mentioned that there's an aluminum radiator manufacturer (don't recall which) who's gone to supplying Evans stuff with the radiators purely because of the difference it makes from a corrosion standpoint. :shrug:
 

mysunnshine

Legacy Registered User
City
Phoenix
State
AZ
Corrosion is more of a maintenance issue assuming that your not using the radiator tank as the ground for the electric fan temp switch like in this case.


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Sent from my SM-G920V
 

FLCJ8

Legacy Registered User
City
Palm Bay
State
FL
Not going to disagree with that and Mike is doing this at the same time as an aluminum radiator and new fan setup.

Not to debate the merits of the waterless coolant, but if BK is doing the radiator,fan, and coolant at the same time and is successful how will this help evaluate the effectiveness of the waterless coolant? Or did I misread your post and he is going to do the testing in incremental steps.
 

FLCJ8

Legacy Registered User
City
Palm Bay
State
FL
There you go. I will be watching with interest. I have picked up an old non-jeep vehicle and snd rebuilding the coolant side of things. I will be trialling the Evans action on this.

Gazzo,
I recently went through educating myself a little when I had to replace the water pump on my '06 Cummins diesel. It uses a HOAT coolant that I had never used before. Upon reading up on the manufacurer requirements and merits of the coolant (could be marketing hype), as well as lots of research on Cummins forums it seems like a superior coolant compared to "old green".
A lot of the info I read was based on chemistry over my head, but the professionals (mysunnshine types) had real compelling scientific reasons why it should be used.
I'm not sure if this would be an answer to your original question, but it may be worth a look.
Here's a link I just found that explains some differences in the different coolants available. It might give you some avenues to research.
http://www.underhoodservice.com/correcting-coolant-confusion/
 

Bad Karma

Captain Sarcasm
BENEFACTOR
Lifetime Member
Member
City
Cobourg, Ontario, Cana
State
da
My LS swap used to stay cool in any conditions. It has an aluminum rad, an electric fan and an 8274 on the bumper too. I have been having issues since I had a seeping leak out of a few tubes at the tank on the rad. I had the rad repaired but I think the shop that did the repair screwed up and sealed off the leaking tubes completely.
Also, my current electric fan dies every 365 days, like clock work. Seriously, you could set a calendar to it.

So this upcoming swap will, hopefully, solve all my problems. More details in the fall issue of JPFreek!
 

mysunnshine

Legacy Registered User
City
Phoenix
State
AZ
So I'll be the devil's advocate here... So if it used to stay cool in all conditions before, then why would you not think that repairing/replacing the radiator and cooling fan wouldn't solve your problem? That's an unfair and canted test for the cooling abilities of waterless coolant before it even gets started. Just saying-

Sent from my SM-G920V
 
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