On board air vs portable air.

sdsupilot

CJ-8 Member
CJ-8.com Member
City
OKC
State
OK
#1
I am looking into compressed air options. Currently I have no "need" (air lockers...), but would like to have air for filling tires and such.

I have 2 york 210s in my work bench. I do think one of these would be the "best" option. By the time I rebuild the compressor, purchase a serpentine clutch, air tank, air lines, electric controls - my "free" OBA turns into 4-500.

Are the additional costs for OBA with an engine driven compressor worth it over a portable 12v unit?
 
City
Harpers Ferry
State
WV
#2
I did the York route 15 yrs ago when I rebuilt my CJ 7. I have never been disappointed in that decision. The front bumper is the air tank.
That being said, on my Scrambler rebuild that I’m starting, I plan on having ac, (gotta keep momma happy) so I’ll go with electric when I get to that point.

To get an electric pump worth anything, your going to be spending a min $2-300 and it still won’t keep up with belt driven.

My .02
 

Jeeper_4_Life

Scrambler Rookie
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
SOA Member
City
Kingman
State
Ks
#3
I am pretty happy with my York on my AMC V8. Mounts easier to come by for it. I don't know what motor you have. Why does compressor need rebuilt? If they worked somewhat before make sure has oil and run it. Manifold, viar pressure switch, pop-off, coalescing filter, suction filter, air tank, on/off switch and some push-on hose/fittings and your there. To some extent you will need a % of those same items for 12V system. Connecting to fittings off the York may be harder part. I used the old AC hoses from a Wagoneer on mine.

I do not have experience with 12V, but can't imagine they will last as long as a York. Plus York can be found in junk yards or old trucks for cheap, and will fill a tire or run impact faster than 12V. CO2 would be faster.
 

93_Fummins

CJ-8 Member
CJ-8.com Member
City
Edmond
State
OK
#4
I inherited a PowerTank with my last Jeep purchase debacle, and honestly, I think that is the way to go if you are only concerned with airing up tires. It's fast, it's portable and transferable, it doesn't take up much space, it requires very minimal fabrication to install, and it doesn't clutter up the engine bay. I'm not going to downplay a York though; they are very tried and true and I would probably lean that way for a dedicated trail rig that had lockers, leaky tires, or needed impact tools.....but even that being said, pneumatic impacts are all but phased out with cordless stuff, so the engine driven air concept falls even further behind portable stuff imho. My 8 will probably end up with the PowerTank and a small 12v pump for lockers and emergency air up when the CO2 is out.
 

sdsupilot

CJ-8 Member
CJ-8.com Member
City
OKC
State
OK
#5
Very good points. One of my two compressors is locked up. However, I could just use the second as it is.

I have a gm tbi 4.3, same mounts as a serpentine SBC. I've seen several different mounts for sale pretty reasonably.

I was looking at a Viair 5 gallon hot dog tank, pressure switch and some 3/8" push on lines. Is a one way valve necessary?

The original plan was to use the York for air tools. I just bought a ridgid 1/2" 18V impact. I would agree that pneumatic tools are less appealing.
 
City
Harpers Ferry
State
WV
#6
Is a one way valve necessary?

The original plan was to use the York for air tools. I just bought a ridgid 1/2" 18V impact. I would agree that pneumatic tools are less appealing.
Yes, you would need a check valve.

There were some very good points made for the CO2 tank. I also use an air horn on my 7, so the tank isn’t really an option for me.
 

tower210

Scrambler Junkie
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
City
Olathe
State
KS
#7
I second the powertank ant that price point...... I bought one 2+ years ago...about 16 per fill. Lasts me about 8 months of Jeep tires and bike tires and car tires..... far faster than any compressor
 

ag4ever

Average Nut
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
City
Richmond
State
TX
#8
I have an Air Armor portable unit that is mounted in an ammo can. My buddy has the ARB one in a plastic tool box. I think mine inflates every bit as well as the ARB one, and works great taking it from vehicle to vehicle. Less than half the cost and much better case.

If I needed to run tools I might go for the York setup, but today’s electric impacts are just as good.

That said, I don’t run trails so I don’t have experience with needing high volumes of air in remote places.
 

Jeeper_4_Life

Scrambler Rookie
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
SOA Member
City
Kingman
State
Ks
#9
As noted check valve is needed before the coalescing filter. I want a cordless impact. My luck with cordless is the battery is typically dead and have to wait to charge. If going on a trip its a little different I would have them ready. I have wanted to get a powertank powershot CO2 as backup for my air locker should my on board die. CO2 and back up 12V without a tank, would be a sound option and probably cleaner setup vs all the hoses etc I have going everywhere. Plus CO2 would help seat a bead due to volume it can put out. In the end, any will work, comes to down complexity, and cost.

4x4 Land out of Topeka posted a 12V air setup they were running a sale on for $75. Was a facebook post, so if you on that look it up.
 

bigwalton

Picture cravin' AK Postal nut
Staff member
SOA Member
City
Dexter
State
MI
#10
I have multiple OBA setups. I have a Kleinn 100% duty rating all-in-one pump/tank unit in my LJ, a Powertank and I converted the 4.0L A/C compressor in the Postal.

The power tank is portable and fast, but it's a 20 min drive one way to fill and I apparently help too many people with air and use it too often at home (so much faster than firing up my large home depot special compressor) because I always feel like it needs a refill. Last time I took it, they wouldn't fill it without going through a recertification test due to its age, which would have required leaving it for a week and more money than I wanted to spend to keep using it at that moment (I go to a fire extinguisher place). I have had issues with the OBA on the Postal and it was a nice backup to have. I got in the habit of bringing it in the postal for bigger events because the mount was up out of the way and it was easier to grab to help someone than trying to get the Postal next to them. I got mine with a discount certificate from the SOA National but I don't know that I'd spend the money on one at full price with the costs of fills.

The Kleinn is nice, but it's the slowest of the options. I like that it simply works when you flip the switch. I tried it last weekend doing a fill on my 37s going from 14psi to 27psi with my IndeFlate unit that fills two tires at the same time and it took an eternity (partialy my fault for not firing it up on the drive out of the park to let it fill the tank). It's easy to mount assuming you have the space and you just need to run power to it and go. If I wheeled the LJ more, I'd plumb air lines to the front and rear similar to what I did with the Postal (see below).

I converted the Sanden in the Postal using the article from JP years ago. No oil supply like the York, so had to disassemble and lube the guts (probably need to redo that). This is by far my favorite of the three. It's ultra fast and I plumbed outputs to the front and rear bumpers and mounted a Viair tank under the bed. With any engine speed, it fills the tank in no time and does great on tires. I'm running it more now that I put the ARBs in the Postal and all of the issues I've had were with my install on the lines/fittings. The only real problem I had getting this system working was getting the high pressure connection at the compressor to take (I had to use a compression fitting on the Sanden's output pipe, which you won't have to deal with).

With my experience, I would 100% do the York if I were you and starting from scratch unless you have a nearby and cheap fill location for the Powertank and really just didn't want to deal with the York. If the York appeals to you at all, go with it. I recommend the tank under the bed with a one-way valve and outlets wherever works for you. If I were doing it over again, I would have put a distribution block near the compressor to start and plug the unused ports just so future additions/expansion was simpler. It took three changes on how I had things set up before I got to that point, I should have done it from the beginning.

FWIW.
 

bigwalton

Picture cravin' AK Postal nut
Staff member
SOA Member
City
Dexter
State
MI
#12
BW what is the psi on the power tank-what are they charging for a refill ?
it’s whatever you need, you regulate it down from more than you can use.

I want to say it was $13-15 per fill, add a 40-45 minute round trip (I’m rarely in the area where the shop is) and I got really annoyed at filling it :shrug:
 

bigwalton

Picture cravin' AK Postal nut
Staff member
SOA Member
City
Dexter
State
MI
#13
I actually now have a York I pulled off of Mater and I honestly have thought about reworking things to use that instead of the Sanden, which isn’t ideal at all compared to the York :shrug:
 

ag4ever

Average Nut
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
City
Richmond
State
TX
#14
BW what is the psi on the power tank-what are they charging for a refill ?
250 psi CO2 tank.

Another option, if you are a diver, is using a 3,000 psi scuba tank and running an air chuck off the low pressure port of the regulator. Air fills on those tanks are usually cheap. Still have to deal with the 5 year hydro and yearly visual inspections, but if you are a diver you deal with that already.

These are some of my tanks:
27D2A397-960A-4F64-9D22-96F40365F51C.jpeg

Standard 80cf to the small 13cf pony.

The CO2 tank is a much better option though as the liquid expansion provides much more volume than the 3,000 psi to 35 psi gas expansion.

Most welding supply houses or paintball outfits should be able to fill the CO2 tank. Or buy a large bulk tank and fill it from home. I have a buddy with a bulk CO2 tank we use to fill our paintball tank. (Actually our SMG-22 tanks).
 

don87401

Scrambler Junkie
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
SOA Member
City
Farmington
State
NM
#15
I have a Warn PowerPlant winch with a tank on my LJ like it, a bit quicker than most of the portable units being used when airing up usually done first. Not a cheap option but if you need a winch might be an option worth looking at.
 

Belizeit

CJ-8 Member
CJ-8.com Member
City
River Ridge
State
La
#16
Yeah I was thinking the power tanks were nearly at the pressure of the scuba tanks which I was thinking at around 2200psi. Thanks
 

ag4ever

Average Nut
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
City
Richmond
State
TX
#17
Yeah I was thinking the power tanks were nearly at the pressure of the scuba tanks which I was thinking at around 2200psi. Thanks
Yea, the typical yoke tanks are 3,000 psi. European DIN tanks can be 200 bar or 300 bar (2,900 psi or 4,300 psi).

CO2 tanks are much less pressure, but the gas is in a liquid state in the tank therefore much denser than compressed gas.

Another option, I strenuously do NOT suggest, is using small camping propane cylinders to fill tires. Knew someone that did that often. Finally was able to talk them out of doing that a number of years ago. :crazy:
 

barrys

Scrambler Junkie
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
City
East Norriton
State
PA
#18
Scuba tanks are very heavy compared to a powertank aren't they? I have an old scuba tank and the thing is stupid heavy. How about a beer meister tank?
 

mwqpd11

Scrambler Junkie
LIFETIME
CJ-8.com Member
City
Coopersburg
State
PA
#19
I have the Power Tank. Filled at the local beer distributor. I have mounts for it in 2 jeeps
 

Scott_P

Legacy Registered User
CJ-8.com Member
City
Benzonia
State
MI
#20
Yorks kick butt. I have one on my Scrambler using all factory mounts and one on my CJ-2A with fabricated mounts. Use them quite often outside of off-road...like if you need to pull some part off your parts jeep that is hidden in the back 40....running an impact wrench, etc.

Today with the improvements in cordless tools that may not be as big a deal it once was, but I still use it.
 
Top