request your input on this YJ for parts

[Bushmaster6]

I hunt my local Craigslist CONSTANTLY for Jeep parts, and 99% of the time, I come up dry (would get much better results if I had a TJ)... but, I found something tonight I might jump on.. in the hope of a drivetrain (or at least engine) swap, I search for CJ and early YJ/XJ motors

found an ad for Pensacola (40 min drive from here) for a 94 YJ in the 1900$ range.. talked to the owner who told me where it was and that he "garunteed" the motor was a good runner (he bought for his own project, gave up on it).. curiosity got the best of me, so I drove over to see it tonight, took a few photos but only one came out

it's a 94 with 4.0L automatic and (reportedly) 107k miles on it.. it appears to me to have been rolled, and I did see (in the dark) what appeared to be a bend in the DS frame.. that said, the motor bay looked like it had it all there (or at least ALOT in there, some piled on top of the engine since the fenders are off it)..

very hasty assessment:
-94 should give me OBD1 (last year of that I think)
-tub looks straight but fenders/hood probably shot
-has A/C
-automatic (I'd probably sell all but the motor/harness), may cause me some work-arounds to hook to my factory T5
-all major engine/intake assemblies appear to be there
-has 4x cheap aluminum rims
-has 2 factory half doors and straight tailgate
-well worn but mostly intact Bestop top and upper 1/2 doors
-seats are worn but presentable
-under dash A/C unit
- power brakes/booster (keep or sell)
- YJ fans/belts turn the proper direction (vs the XJ, yes?)

my initial thoughts: if I have any reasonable assurance it's a good motor, I could probably make MOST of the cost of the whole truck back by parting it out/re-selling it minus the motor (plus the sale of my own and it's accompanying MC2150 kit)

I'm thinking of buying a compression tester and running over there tomorrow with a battery to see if I can get it to crank/compression test

it's been awhile since I spent much time reading CJOffroad about this swap, but it's reportedly not too hard (especially OBD1), and this one seems to have low enough miles to make it a buy..

any thoughts? issues from a rollover that are of concern to the

 

[Randyzzz]

Initial thought...1900 seems a bit high for a rolled YJ, especially if you are just looking for the engine. YJ parts resale is poor over here...

Offer 1000!

 

[AK-RWC]

I call dibs on the half-doors.

 

[bigwalton]

My first two thoughts included both Randy's and AK's comments.

The price is too high for what it is, you can get non-rolled running YJs for that, agreed that you offer $1k

The half doors alone could net you a big chunk of the $1k.

94 is a good year for a swap and you want the whole vehicle. Not sure on the rotation, but it's a small/cheap fix anyway. I *think* you can use the auto computer with a manual fine, it's the other way that's a problem IIRC.

at $1k or even 1200, I think it works to get you close or over the initial price if you're willing to really part the crap out of it and even if you only sell off the big things, it will be a cheap 4.0.

All that assumes you start it, the fluids are all good, there's no obvious issues and the compression test works.

 

[Bushmaster6]

thanks guys, that's a good reality check.. I was getting a bit too excited as it was the first one I saw in a LONG time in a decent price range..

I casually shop for whole truck/runners for part out as I prefer to have one that comes with everything I need in lieu of the time/effort/frustration of pick-n-pull and eBay/web classifieds. I do see some beater XJs in the mid 2k range here, but higher mileage... or they are later models/more complicated swaps then I'd want to attempt. I have casually shopped for awhile, and this one got me excited cuz it was the first I've seen that "fit the bill".

I've also shopped for CJ runners and head swap options, as I consider this a simpler/user friendly route, but they've been elusive (here in FLA) as well. If I was back in CO I'd probably have it all on hand by now. Crate motors are an option too, but I still end up with old intake, exhaust, and emission technology.

Going to run to Sears and buy compression tester at lunch and try to check this out in the daylight today..

 

[bigwalton]

Ineresting, around here XJs are a good bit cheaper than YJs in my experience. I was casually watching for a good while too for the same reason.

Might be because the salt gets to the XJs pretty good, especially the rockers, when they're older here. Good fodder for motor/tranny swaps though!!

 

[Orionn]

Here is my two cents

$1900....No way, I'd wave $900 cash under his nose. He'll probably bite (take a friend with you for backup...you dont need to get mugged)

The t-case is worth about $75-$100
The trans about the same $$ (should be a 999)

If I remember correctly, the YJ stayed OBD-I thrue '95.

Dana 30 disconect front axle -$50
Dana 35 Rear axle -free on up

about $400 for the tub if its straight
the family roll cage sell well around here -$150
the windshield frmae is shot, but the wipers and hinges should be good $25 to $50 (if your lucky)
seats- all 3 -$100ish
Steering column non-tilt -$50 Tilt -$100+
hood -$25
Grill -$25
Frame if straight -$250+
Stock Springs -$50 to $100

the rest of it, depends on what accesories it has in the dash and how long you want to hold onto things while selling it.

As for the Computer, yes it should ignore the manual trans. The engine is a good swap over to your rig.
If it was rolled you really dont know how long it sat upside down. better to be safe than sorry and pull the plugs befor you try and crank it over and check the oil level.
The 4.0L HO engine is prety bullet proof, but they dont like to be run dry or with oil in the cylenders (hydrolocked).
Dont be suprised if the compression numbers seem low, depending on how long it has been sitting.
Dont forget that the fuel system will need to be retrofitted for the fuel injection.
Yiou can use the YJ system, OR you can use a Ford F150 ( late'80s early '90s) frame rail mounted fuel pump.

Its a prety big project to strip a YJ out, but you can make some cash of them.

Good luck

 

[Bushmaster6]

xj cheaper here too

they are here as well...running YJ run in the 4k and up range, and that's starting with the 2.5L motors.. this particular YJ is obviously different, for obvious damage, but I'm not looking for a body..

Ineresting, around here XJs are a good bit cheaper than YJs in my experience. I was casually watching for a good while too for the same reason.

Might be because the salt gets to the XJs pretty good, especially the rockers, when they're older here. Good fodder for motor/tranny swaps though!!

 

[Bushmaster6]

Orionn..

thanks, lots of detail there. I used to try and read up/research the swap thread to build a base of knowledge on how to do this swap, but frankly got overwhelmed over time trying to piece it all together.. lots of sites, lots of opinions, lots of individual problems to sort through.. gaaah! I'm sure (if this goes down) I'll be relying heavily on this board, as usual, for straightforward answers (and not "search!" replies)... best CJ site on the net.

I'm thinking of offering around 1k.. might go a bit higher if he's got the capability to deliver it (it's a 45 min drive from my house, an hour or more from the shop where I do bigger projects.. and that's not a cheap tow truck distance)

other option is I might offer him less for just what I need:bascially everything in the engine bay plus the computer/harness.. but then I have to dork around with on-site labor (if he agrees) to pull it..

I went to sears today and got my compression test guage, going to bring a battery, some gas, and meet the guy here in a few hours..

 

[Orionn]

No problem.

Good luck with it.

 

[Bushmaster6]

bought it for 1200..

was able to get compression test on 5 of 6 cylinders (the forward most plug is in tight behind the A/C compressor and I dropped the damn fitting for the compression guage down in the a/c compressor bracket.. had no magnet with me so.. it's going to stay there until I get the thing home/apart... d'oh!). I clocked about 120 on the guage for all 5 cylinders that I did check, and this was on a cold motor after about 3 cranks per cylinder.. not sure what the specs are on the 4.0, but that compared well to compression testing on my 4.2).

oil on dipstick looked good, all spark plugs looked to be "good" normal wear, and when I hooked up the battery, the motor only had to turn over for a few moments to catch and run.. and it's been sitting cold for a good while.. didn't run it for very long, perhaps 2 minutes after I finished up the compression test (no coolant visible in the radiator so didn't want to overheat it), it definitely has a header/exhaust leak (noise and some exhaust smoke), but nothing blue out of the tailpipe and it settled into an idle pretty quickly

one thing I noted today that I didn't see yesterday.. about half way down on the block, below the sparkplugs, were handwrittne letters that said either "D" or "C".. mean anything to anyone? you can actually see one of the white "D"s in the picture in the first post..

and nowwwww.. time to start searching for good YJ/OBD1 swap threads/sites... over my head, over my heaaaddddd

 

[bigwalton]

Sweet, git er dun!

Best bet would be CJOffroad.com but it has been down every time I've been back over there in the past few months.

 

[Randyzzz]

1200...perfect. Now you got a good deal. And now, the fun begins!

 

[Orionn]

$1200, not bad...How much negotiating did you do?

Anyhow, your compression test numbers are all pretty low. Not surprising though with the engine sitting for awhile.

If I may make a suggestion: Before you start tearing into the YJ, lets see where your at with the engine. No sense in pulling an engine and doing a swap before you know what the engine condition really is.

I would suggest you add some water to the cooling system and start the engine again and let it warm up AT IDLE. Dont preasurize the cooling system yet.
You need to get some oil back into the head and crank bearings/pistons again.

Aterwards, re-run your compression test both hot and cold and check the numbers.
Hopefully the readings will read more in the 175-180 psi range on all cylinders. 160 psi is about the lowest you want to see.

If not, re-run the compression test again wet and warm on the low cylinder(s) and see if you get improvement. (if you do, we'll go from there)

Post up what you find or any questions you may have.

 

[CBRogers]

Unless you are really stuck on a shifter I would suggest that you run the automatic that comes with the YJ. It should be a 999, and it will have the access port for the Crank Position Sensor already in place.

The only requirement for hooking to the Dana 300 would be a 1/2 or 5/8" thick spacer. You could actually get a clocking ring and accomplish the same thing while being able to rotate the transfer case higher in the frame.

The 999 is a pretty good automatic. You can get the crack in the header re-welded, and it should do OK for a while. It will last a lot longer if you use a flex joint at the exit of the exhaust header and then support the exhaust there too.

The wiring harness can be sorted down to 5 wires to fire. Those are the ones that need connection to the CJ's system.

You should be able to sell the Tub to a CJ guy for $4-500.

If you decide to keep the 5spd. Let me know I might be interested in the 999. IIRC Novak can re-drill the clutch housing to use the CPS from the Auto. You will need to short the Neutral Safety Switch, and the idle will be a bit higher but all in all the engine should do fine in the CJ.



Carl

 

[Bushmaster6]

BW.. yes, CJOffroad has been "CJOFFLINE" for a few months.. lots of discussion on other boards about it.. that site used to make my head hurt with data about this swap.. that's the downside of the wide variety of jeep enthusiasm, there are few "one stop shop" references..

negotiating.. I came up 200, he went down 550 so.. not bad.. the proof will be "in the pudding" when I find out how much I can get back from parting it, and if this motor's as good as I hope it is

Orionn: concur on the run-it-in place first.. figured I"d get it as good as possilbe while it runs in it's original home, and then pull it when the time comes.. was wondering if I should do any preventative maint while it's out (other than new plugs, wires, etc... like timing chain, gasket sets, etc?) at some point it'll probably end up on an engine stand so, will have "easy" access to it there

CB: wiring... my 8 has a Painless harness (installed by me), so it's still well labeled and I'm at least familiar with where everything goes, trick will be to sort the YJ harness out

I've started to kick around the idea of going automatic already.. not sure if that makes it easier or harder.. assume I'd have to change steering columns... do they swap YJ to CJ?,
is there then a residual effect on wiring under the dash (that big flat black plug/harness on the column? Or would I replace that with the one from my CJ?
the jeep is obviously not driveable, so no way to easily test it.. and my T5 is a fresh rebuild.. (not that it's a great tranny, but did plunk a bit of money into it.. might make resale an option)

 

[Orionn]

Orionn: concur on the run-it-in place first.. figured I"d get it as good as possilbe while it runs in it's original home, and then pull it when the time comes.. was wondering if I should do any preventative maint while it's out (other than new plugs, wires, etc... like timing chain, gasket sets, etc?) at some point it'll probably end up on an engine stand so, will have "easy" access to it there

CB: wiring... my 8 has a Painless harness (installed by me), so it's still well labeled and I'm at least familiar with where everything goes, trick will be to sort the YJ harness out

I've started to kick around the idea of going automatic already.. not sure if that makes it easier or harder.. assume I'd have to change steering columns... do they swap YJ to CJ?,
is there then a residual effect on wiring under the dash (that big flat black plug/harness on the column? Or would I replace that with the one from my CJ?
the jeep is obviously not driveable, so no way to easily test it.. and my T5 is a fresh rebuild.. (not that it's a great tranny, but did plunk a bit of money into it.. might make resale an option)

Clean all the oil of the engine, then start it and get it hot. Then recheck the compression on all cylinders. If the compression numbers are good, equal across all 6 (within the spec range), give it a tune up and check for oil leaks (thats why you cleaned it up) and leave it alone till your ready to install it in the CJ.

If you still have low compression, do a 'wet' compression test on the low cylinders (on a hot engine)
If its still low, you may need to pull the head. but befor you do that, you can see if the rings are stuck by adding a few ounces of Seafoam to the low Cylinders, and cranking it over gently By HAND with NO plugs in it! and letting it sit a day or so while you do other things.
The seafoam will break down the carbon on sticky rings and let them seal again.
Just be sure to blow out the leftover seafoam befor you put the plugs back in, and let it idle after you restart it till the exhaust burns clean again. Its going to smoke...alot!
then recheck the low cylinders compression again. if they are still low (and out of spec) your going to probably have to pull the head for a visual inspection.

If I remember correctly, the steering column in the YJ is a newer version of the CJ column, they should swap, but why bother, you could just run a floor mounted cable shifter for the transmsion.

The YJ electrical is NOTHING like the CJ harness...esspecially the painless harness your using.
get a good copy of the YJ wiring diagram and start tracing out the circuts you want to keep.
Your going to be busy with that for some time.
But befor you do that, you may find it easier to pull the painless harness, and install the entire YJ harness in the CJ (if its not too hacked up already).
Think about that.....it has its merits, basically everything becomes 'plug-n-play'.

Food For Thought.

 

[bigwalton]

The wiring, especially with OBD1 is not that hard at all. I would not bother swapping out the CJ harness, the CJ side is the easy part. I'd bet good money that half a day of searching out there will find you the exact wire colors needed on this year YJ to fire. Take your time to find those (this is where you first need the FSM for the detailed wiring diagrams). Connect those where needed and start it up. DO NOT cut anything out of the YJ harness until you get it running.

Once you have it running you can either pull the YJ harness out and start paring it down or you can do it installed in the CJ. Installed is a little more trouble but you can test after every wire cut if you want to be cautious. If you're really comfortable with the wiring/connector diagrams, it's easy to do with it on the garage floor.

If I do an OBDI in the future (after having done the OBDII in mine), I'd just cut off the needed plugs for connecting to the engine and build my own harness with new plugs to get into the CJ harness where needed. That's an option as well, it's only 5 wires going into what you need to build and if you know your way around relays, it's pretty simple.

I kept the power distribution center (PDC) from the XJ and have started moving CJ circuits over to that to make certain things relay-operated (reduces current in old CJ wiring) and centralize the wiring/fuses with a 13 year newer system. I just kept the input/output wires for the PDC, labeled them as to which fuse/relay they connect, and have them bundled out of the way until I need them.

 

[Orionn]

I kept the power distribution center (PDC) from the XJ and have started moving CJ circuits over to that to make certain things relay-operated (reduces current in old CJ wiring) and centralize the wiring/fuses with a 13 year newer system. I just kept the input/output wires for the PDC, labeled them as to which fuse/relay they connect, and have them bundled out of the way until I need them.

This is the reason I sugested using the YJ harness in the CJ.
The newer harness is more reliable, and is relay based.

With a llittle work, he could just run the YJ engine harness and leave the Painless for the rest of the duty.

Alot of options, you just need to pick what is best for you and your most comfortable with.

 

[bigwalton]

Oh, I read it as replace the painless harness completely with the YJ. That's why I was confused.