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Noisy elec fuel pump? Too hot? Wrong location?

MomoJeep

MomoJeep

Basic User
City
Seattle
State
WA
My HESCO pump lasted 10 years. Impressive. Replaced it with one of the ones they put in F150's. After 20 mins of driving it's whining like a baby. My HESCO pump would occasionally do the same thing *IF* it was really hot out and I was pushing it hard. But this one is doing it just driving down the street on relatively cool day.

My exhaust is somewhat close to the pump. I've seen some of these pumps come with insulation sleeves.. Could it be getting too hot?
OR
I've heard some of these are "push" pumps and some are "pull". My filter is between the tank and the pump. Maybe it should be the other way around?

Anyone have insight on this?
 
In my opinion, the only pump that is a "pull" pump is a vacuum pump. Every other pump should be as close to the fluid source as possible with as little restriction as possible. You might check the the filter to see if it's clogged, or possibly blow back the line into the tank. There may have been an issue in the system that knocked out the HESCO in the first place.
 
93_Fummins said:
In my opinion, the only pump that is a "pull" pump is a vacuum pump. Every other pump should be as close to the fluid source as possible with as little restriction as possible. You might check the the filter to see if it's clogged, or possibly blow back the line into the tank. There may have been an issue in the system that knocked out the HESCO in the first place.
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My filter is between my pump and the tank. I'm thinking I will switch them around. This will also put the pump in the center of the rear cross-member, moving it away from the heat of exhaust. I hope this two changes will make a difference..!? Does anyone know:

(a) Does the MPI kit tell people to put the filter between tank and pump, or between pump and engine?
(b) How are Wranglers set up? (or are they all in-tank pumps?
(c) The E2000 pump used of F150's ... how do they have then pump/filter arranged?

Thanks!
 
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All electric pumps are push pumps. Most pumps call for a “loose” filter before and a “fine“ filter after the pump.
 
The Holley sniper efi fuel kit includes a 10 micron post filter and 20 micron pre filter.

pre filter - napa 3033

post filter - napa 3482

They use a frame mounted pump, but also state, “The fuel pump MUST be mounted lower than the lowest part of the fuel tank, and as close to the fuel tank as possible.”

Their diagram shows a 40-100 micron pre filter and 10 micron post filter.

So, if the sock meets the above requirements, then I guess it could be a filter.

Fuel pump in the efi kit is marked PRD30768 instruction list 12-920. 62 gph at 60 psi.

When I installed the efi I went a different route, I am in the camp that believes high pressure fuel pumps should be submerged in fuel, not external. But, everybody has an opinion. YMMV.
 
On my cj7 the previous owner had used an in tank pump with a Mopar mpfi kit, but when I bought the jeep the pump was too weak with only 30psi at the rail. I ended up adding an in line pump on the frame rail near the fuel tank and splicing into the in tank pump power.

I used a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00029JK5U/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm currently trying to install the holley kit on my scrambler, using their 15 gallon sender in a 20 gallon. This has required adding a return fitting and bending the feed for clearance on the tank rim. I would recommend not getting their sender unless you are also getting THEIR 15 gallon since the plumb the return right to the tank and not the sender.
 
V3X8Te said:
On my cj7 the previous owner had used an in tank pump with a Mopar mpfi kit, but when I bought the jeep the pump was too weak with only 30psi at the rail. I ended up adding an in line pump on the frame rail near the fuel tank and splicing into the in tank pump power.

I used a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00029JK5U/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm currently trying to install the holley kit on my scrambler, using their 15 gallon sender in a 20 gallon. This has required adding a return fitting and bending the feed for clearance on the tank rim. I would recommend not getting their sender unless you are also getting THEIR 15 gallon since the plumb the return right to the tank and not the sender.
Click to expand...

UPDATE: I just re-read the Mopar MPI kit instructions, and it say to put the filter BEFORE the fuel pump, to prevent debris from the tank entering the pump.. .and NOT to put the filter downstream from the pump. This answers my question! I'm going to put in an Airtex E2000 pump (that comes with a insulation sleeve (and I'll probably also put a rubber basket between the frame rail and pump mount surface to insulate noise.
 
To answer one of your original questions, fuel injected Wranglers came with in tank pumps from the factory.
IMO, in the tank is the best place for the pump. Shortest pickup length and liquid cooling increases durability and being in the tank makes for quieter operation. Only real down side is installation and replacement usually means dropping the gas tank.
Fuel tank mod.jpgFuel Pump.jpg
 
Spieg said:
To answer one of your original questions, fuel injected Wranglers came with in tank pumps from the factory.
IMO, in the tank is the best place for the pump. Shortest pickup length and liquid cooling increases durability and being in the tank makes for quieter operation. Only real down side is installation and replacement usually means dropping the gas tank.
View attachment 93193View attachment 93194
Click to expand...
What fuel pump assembly is that?
 
Spieg said:
To answer one of your original questions, fuel injected Wranglers came with in tank pumps from the factory.
IMO, in the tank is the best place for the pump. Shortest pickup length and liquid cooling increases durability and being in the tank makes for quieter operation. Only real down side is installation and replacement usually means dropping the gas tank.
View attachment 93193View attachment 93194
Click to expand...
Yes, I was aware of the in-tank option. I had a good oem 20-gallon tank in my scrambler and wanted to keep it. I had seen a "wrangler" set-up that seemed to have a rectangular shaped opening in the tank. I thought all wranglers were that way. But based on your picture there is a roind opening wrangler pump that will fit a CJ tank?

NOTE: my external pump did great for 10 years, and was abused by being too close to the heat of the exhaust. I like that it is so easily trail-serviced if needed.
 
1) Buy a new pump from Hesco. Yes, they cost more, but they seem to be a much better quality than the generic store bought pumps. I had 10 years/close to 50,000 miles on an external Hesco MPI pump. Never had a "heat" problem with it.

2) I originally ran the filter in front of the pump for 10 years, no problems. I just put the filter after the pump, no problems.

3) On my green Scrambler (4.2/Mopar MPI), I am using a "Tanks Inc" internal fuel pump for the primary. BUT, I also installed a new Hesco external pump, already plumbed up and wired, as an emergency spare. Best of both worlds.
 
That’s awesome.

I noticed the Hesco instructions say to mount the external pump on the center bolt of the rear crossmember. Somehow mine got mounted on the driver side bolt a few inches from the exhaust pipe! Oops… still lasted over 10 years but would get really noisy on hot days in the desert.
 
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Bennie at Hesco confirmed today on the phone.. the filter goes BEFORE the pump to keep any debris out of the pump.
 
spankrjs said:
1) Buy a new pump from Hesco. Yes, they cost more, but they seem to be a much better quality than the generic store bought pumps. I had 10 years/close to 50,000 miles on an external Hesco MPI pump. Never had a "heat" problem with it.

2) I originally ran the filter in front of the pump for 10 years, no problems. I just put the filter after the pump, no problems.

3) On my green Scrambler (4.2/Mopar MPI), I am using a "Tanks Inc" internal fuel pump for the primary. BUT, I also installed a new Hesco external pump, already plumbed up and wired, as an emergency spare. Best of both worlds.
Click to expand...
that's Awesome!
Could you send me a link (or the name) to the internal fuel pump that you have? I’ll try to remember if I ever have to drop the tank again.

Any concern that the two combined put too much pressure on the system, the hoses, the regulator?
 
Spieg said:
To answer one of your original questions, fuel injected Wranglers came with in tank pumps from the factory.
IMO, in the tank is the best place for the pump. Shortest pickup length and liquid cooling increases durability and being in the tank makes for quieter operation. Only real down side is installation and replacement usually means dropping the gas tank.
View attachment 93193View attachment 93194
Click to expand...
@Spieg do you have a write up on that pump? I'm planning my EFI swap now.
 
I bought the Novak fuel pump assembly so I could have in tank pump and not knowing really how they put it together. After getting it could be made if you can source the electrical bits to isolate from the sender body. All they do is modify a stock CJ sending unit, add wires/bushings to run the power through the flange, and add submersible fuel hose to connect to the pump. You could do the same thing by getting a Walboro or whatever mfg pump and measure from inside bottom of tank to sending flange, then figure out how much of the steel pickup to cut off and replace with the hose. so your pump screen sits on the bottom of the tank. Use EFI fuel clamps and figure out the wiring.

@Spieg picture of pump assembly doesn't have a fuel sender on it, it is the separate fitting in the middle of the tank. So if you used that you would have to rig up a different way for a fuel gauge to stock CJ dash.

Dropping the tank sucks, but the pump will last a lot longer being cooled by the fuel as mentioned already.
 
I was going to go this route on my 5.0 swap- Scroll down to see post #1275
www.pirate4x4.com

TOTW: Ford 302 engine swaps

I bought mine on-line new from a dealership, I think Mark (welndmn) has the part number on his web site somewhere or other. I thought I had it but I can't find it.. It was the same price new as used so it was just easier not to pull it.. EDIT: http://www.wt4x4.net/tech/psswap.htm
www.pirate4x4.com www.pirate4x4.com
 
MomoJeep said:
that's Awesome!
Could you send me a link (or the name) to the internal fuel pump that you have? I’ll try to remember if I ever have to drop the tank again.

Any concern that the two combined put too much pressure on the system, the hoses, the regulator?
Click to expand...

Starts around post #285:

spankrjs's Biloxi, MS '83 Scrambler

Can you feel a "seat of the pants" power difference from the new engine? Yes, huge difference :thumbsup: 1) - completely overhauled engine, .40 over bore 2) - NEW Hesco MPI kit installed to replace the OEM computer controlled carb Much more powerful, holds speed with less gas pedal, much...
www.cj-8.com

Both pumps do NOT run at the same time. I have two totally independent fuel pump systems installed:

1) Hesco external pump plumbed through the original CJ sending unit (OEM gas gauge still 100% functional). This is secondary.

2) Primary is a "TanksInc" internal fuel pump.

The linked thread/pictures explain it all :thumbsup:
 
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