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When A Restoration Is Only A Rebuild

D

Dave K.

Legacy Registered User
City
Milwaukee
State
WI
Here's a good example:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Jeep...2408338?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item3371ca3112

The price is way too high for what you are getting and the diamond plate and over-use of liner just makes this Jeep even more incorrect. I mean, slapping that diamond plate on makes this look cheap and likely covers up flaws in the work done. Dunno, but this is a rebuild and not a restoration . . . .

I posted this here because I continually see the mis-use of terms such as restoration, "upgrades" and so on. Superseats are not an upgrade nor is a Weber for example. A good running Carter will do just fine (if you can find one of course). I would consider the one-piece axles an upgrade but anything else is normally just a modification from original.

Examples of things which aren't upgrades but rather mods include:

liner material
carbs
different diffs
engine swaps
wheels
tires
winches (the original 8274 or Ramsey were great winches)

I would consider the following to be upgrades but deviation from original:
fuel injection
HEI ignition
Chevy heater blower (larger and more volume)
1 piece rear axles for the Dana 20
Dana 44 rear end swap (original Jeep equipment)

The reason I write this is more and more many people are finding original Jeeps and highly modifying them and believing they are adding value and making them worth more. Negative! The buyers who would pay $26K for a Scram want original stuff on it--and they don't want Line-X, diamond plate, incorrect decals, chrome dash bezel, cheapo dash pads and aftermarket steering wheels.

When considering a restoration consult the folks here/elsewhere and find the right parts. Scramblers and other CJs were quite capable off road in stock form, the seats when new were VERY comfortable (so should be rebuilt and recovered if possible), and so on.

For the not-so-informed I feel these ads are deceiving and Jeeps like this avoided if you are looking for an original . . . .

Just one person's opinion but if you want to get bucks out of your Scram resto don't follow this sellers lead . . . he'll likely sit on this for a while at this price. It's a nice Jeep but not $26K nice . . .
 
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I still can't believe he paid good money for th original stripe kit, then discarded the rocker strips for alum treadplate (custom cut even).
 
Those wood rails are an abomination and required a second set of holes in the rear roll bar.

I figure that every addition to your jeep that is not stock or OEM either decreases the value if you started from stock, or increases the value ~25% of what you paid for it. E.g. - if you started out with no seats, adding Superseats is better than nothing, but if you paid $500 for them, you'll only see about $125 of it on the back end.

Any addition that is stock or OEM will add 50-75% of that items value.

But keep in mind that you make a Jeep your own. Someone else may or may not find the things that you've done valuable.
 
That's your opinion and I agree with a lot of it and disagree with some, but all you're saying is that's your take. You could do some little thing that you don't think anything of an it could add a ton of value to someone else based on their own opinions. Great thing about people, they're all different ;)

You also have to keep in mind you're reading an ad for someone selling something, by definition they're going to try to put a positive spin (and value) on everything that they possibly can. I'm sure you have issues (as do I) with how a lot of brand new products are marketed, this is no different.

I won't disagree with you on the overall price though and the words of caution to buyers, but there are a lot of great deals to be had out there for people that want a great Scrambler that's not necessarily a restoration candidate if they look past a lot of the little things that would turn many "purists" off. So there's two sides to it (of course the price needs to match what it is, without question).
 
"Rare Automatic"....

Anybody notice the brake pedal is for a manual shift Jeep? That's a nice daily driver, nothing more.
 
I didn't see that nor the ugly siderails the first go around . . . .

I agree each to their own but I really don't like when people claim something is an upgrade when in reality it's only an aftermarket deal that really doesn't enhance performance over the original config for the average Joe. If you're going to mod make it easy to reverse would be my point--and keep the original parts. The fastest sales market for Scrams is the originals and not the modded based on what I've seen. On the other hand the originals are only valuable because so many others have been modded! Catch-22!
 
I agree 100% on the restoration versus "restification" aspect. But, paying a shop to do a frame off would probably run more than the "Buy It Now" price.

However, for that kind of money, I'd at least expect the rear crossmember to be straight, and the steering box removed before painting the front. I'm sure there's more "oops", but I stopped looking.

Would be a great daily driver, but not a collectors showpiece, IMHO.
 
The biggest thing I have an issue with is anyone buying a Scrambler while thinking about it's value on resale, that's going to almost always be a losing proposition. Can it be done, yes. Is it likely, no, unless you do find a pristine original. This becomes especially true when you start paying shop labor over doing things yourself.

I always say don't worry about value (there's better vehicles out there for that) and just buy a Scrambler you like in your budget and do with it what you want and use it.

If that's a nut and bolt restoration, awesome, if it's a built do-it-all rig, cool, no matter what, take lots of pics to post :smokin:

EDIT: Another thought, you don't know what this Scrambler in this ad looked like when they started. It could have been a major mess and this is much closer to original than it was. It's definitely not a restoration of course, so that's still not correct, but it could represent a "saved" Scrambler.
 
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Posted that one up last week - at least he had given some semi-honest answers down at the bottom (Last weeks attempt to sell it) Guess it's a good thing it didn't meet the reserve, now he can try again dishonestly.

...and you spelled unmelested wrong, valkster.
 
I really hope the guy posting this on eBay isn't as much of a hick as he appears to be. I've seen better spelling from a Russian in Siberia who never "speeked" english before much less "tawked" to an english speeker. Alas, sadly I see that texting english is slowly creeping into our written message including the now stock spelling of "ur". It's pretty pathetic how illiterate the masses are these days . . . .

I envision the seller gnawing on something while wearing a wife beater shirt (something from the sleaveless fashion line at Farm and Fleet), eyeballing his daughter in a strange way and telling his wife to go get pizza at the Target "deli" . . . . all the while scratching himself a lot in all the wrong places . . . . and then "wantin' to shake on it".

Truly hope he's trying to be funny and not this dim!
 
There's a CJ Laredo on eBay right now (a brown metallic one)--what baffles me is how you restore something and slap liner on the inside. Personally I don't understand the purpose of liner on a restored vehicle, especially under carpet. Somehow this stuff has grown to the point where it's accepted like paint . . . . and "better than original". Nothing beats a straight floor with no liner on it . . . .
 
Dave K. said:
There's a CJ Laredo on eBay right now (a brown metallic one)--what baffles me is how you restore something and slap liner on the inside. Personally I don't understand the purpose of liner on a restored vehicle, especially under carpet. Somehow this stuff has grown to the point where it's accepted like paint . . . . and "better than original". Nothing beats a straight floor with no liner on it . . . .
Click to expand...

X2 :cheers:
 
The second owner of my Scrambler (I am owner 4) did a complete restoration using ONLY Jeep replacement parts; right down to purchasing Daimler Chrysler dash light bulbs. The third owner proceeded to hack things all to pieces. When I bought the rig, it came with two totes full of Daimler Chrysler parts that had been removed...

Personally, I am more along the lines of creating a vehicle I desire to own and drive... My only concern with the value of it is for insurance replacement costs...
 
twmattox said:
Personally, I am more along the lines of creating a vehicle I desire to own and drive... My only concern with the value of it is for insurance replacement costs...
Click to expand...

Agreed.

If you were to do a nut/bolt, true restoration, then definitely don't line it. But, to me, for anything less than that where you're not trying to replicate the showroom condition it's hard to argue against the protection and sound deadening offered by properly applied liner.

Of course a prospective buyer could and should question what's under it if they're buying, but, as most folks here know by now, I always say that I don't think anyone doing anything less than a true nut/bolt restoration should ever worry about the value on a CJ. Just build it how you like to enjoy it yourself. There are much better options for vehicular investment.
 
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