OT: Retro Wrangler/Willys Pickup (long)

[doslocos]

Jeff

Mostly I was talking about the wood and stainless strips inside the bed. I like that look. He definitely has the scale wrong. I really like your rendering and think it is going to look right, Plus if his is worth $30k+ just think what yours will value at.
Steve

 

[jscherb]

Craig,
Yup, you're right about my drawing, I fixed it and put it in the original post, so check it out above. Also tried to add a little more of the tail-dragger look to the hitch and bumper.

Steve,
I agree on the bed wood and stainless strips, I do plan to do that on mine.

Now I have to gain my confidence back that mine won't look like this :-)
Jeff

 

[jscherb]

I heard back from the seller on eBay. He says the wheelbase is 11', which is about 4" longer than my design. He says the overall length is 17', which is a almost a foot longer than my design, and the bed is 6', which is a bit shorter than my design. Not sure how accurate his measurements are but confirms a much longer cab/shorter bed than my design.

 

[shawnboy]

uh oh

I can see why you are scared. I think his bed sides are too low. His frame drop and rear bumper are completely wrong. And it looks like he used parts from a boat trailer for the rear fenders. The steel top on your plans looks a whole lot better than his. I think your cab is shorter also. IMO your on the right track.

 

[Randyzzz]

Your rendering of what you are planning is ALOT more visually pleasing then the EBay rig. Here's what I think your drawing has over his...

1. His top is awful, looks like a bubble, and the rear window is way too large.
2. His bed is too low- makes it look longer than it really is.
3. His fender flares are too short, again accentuating the looong bed.
4. Jeff- in your drawing, isn't your bed -to scale- shorter than his?
5. Your spare tire and wood panels break up the plain look of the bed.
6. His bed is smooth all the way down, like a cheap dump trailer.
7. His wheel/tire combo is not visually pleasing, and I think too small too.

I would try some "kitbashing"- remember building models when you were a kid? Get a Wrangler, a 50 Chev, and maybe a Willys P/U model and build, in scale, what you're going for.

Suggestion- I just sold a trailer made from 50 Chev shortbed. It was really shallow. You might want to consider scratch-building a bed, or using the 50 Chev bed for a starting point. Your drawing shows your bed sitting on top of the frame, with filler panels masking the frame. His bed is smooth all the way down, which I think makes it look quite awkward.

Ok...my "Paint" skills suck...but I think the top plays a huge factor- check it out...

 

[jscherb]

Randy,
Thanks, I think you are correct on your points. I wish I could find the plastic models to "kitbash", I would definitely build a scale model.

Take a look at the series of photos below. They are top to bottom:

1. Stock Willys pickup, 118" WB

2. Brute pickup, 118" WB. Note cab is a foot longer than the Willys cab and the bed is shorter.

3. Brute photo doctored to be 128" WB with 7' bed, same size I plan to build. Looks pretty good (in fact I like it better than the "stock" shorter Brute).

4. The YJ pickup from eBay, supposedly 11' WB (131"). Pictures speak louder than words :-). The eBay seller says his bed is 6' long, somehow the measurements don't sync up for me. Not sure what's going on...

Note the Willys and Brute beds are much taller than the YJ PU bed, I think that contributes to the better look. (Randy's point #2)

Thanks for all your input, I'm less scared now :-)
Jeff

 

[Randyzzz]

I like the stretch you did to the Brute. Looks good. I gotta say it- erase the picture of the EBay "thing" from your mind. It's just plain ugly. Looks like a CJ10A towing a lawn and garden trailer. Yours looks first class.

If that EBay one stays low, one of us should buy it and fix it...

As for models...

50's Chevy Pickups...
http://cgi.ebay.com/1994-AMT-1950-P...178434909QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item130178434909
http://cgi.ebay.com/AMT-1950-s-Chev...186695834QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item290186695834
Jeep CJ...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Revell-1-24-77-...178611326QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item190178611326

Couldn't find a good LJ...unless you wanted to work with a Diecast 1/24 scale...Here's a bunch of cool stuff...http://www.allthingsjeep.com/models.html

Oh...here's some more inspiration...Toyota FJ45's- the bed is lower, but it looks OK. I like the quarter windows in the hardtop.

 

[doslocos]

I have to agree with Randyzzz, your stretched version looks much better than the original brute. I just love those things. I was looking at older tj to do a conversion when I found my scambler. I just couldn't resist the scrambler. I drove a fj-45 in Costa Rica for a while it was awesome, it had a diesel and a 4spd. That's when I fell for that look. I think your on the right track and I can't waite to see how it turns out. Looks like you've put a lot of fore thought in to what your going to do. Plus it seems you have a lot of support from this web site.
p.s. sorry I posted about the thing on ebay. I just liked the inside of the bed all the rest is someone elses problem. it's at over 4k now

 

[jscherb]

Randy, Steve,

Thanks for your moral support today :-)

"Looks like a CJ10A towing a lawn and garden trailer". LOL. Exactly! We'd better watch out, Craig is probably reading the cracks about the CJ10a :-)

This week I'm going to a canvas top place with my drawings of how the LJ soft top needs to get modified into a pickup top to get their advice (don't worry, no huge "picture window" on the back of mine!); next week I pick up the LJ frame which will form the longer back half of my conversion frame. Also this week I think I'll order the steel to begin making my fenders (which won't look like garden trailer fenders). So I'll keep pressing ahead and I'll keep you posted on progress.

Oh and about the quarter windows, I like them too... when I lived in the UK last year I was looking at Land Rover half-cabs to see how much work it would be to adapt them to the Jeep tub, I thought I could pick one up cheaply over there and bring it home with me (in addition to bringing home the CJ-7 World Cab), but in the end I decided it would put the amount of metal work required to fab the hardtop over the edge for me and I decided not to pursue it. But they are cool.

Thanks,
Jeff

 

[jscherb]

Project update: making progress collecting the parts... here's the parts I saved from the LJ frame I got on eBay. By cutting the current LJ frame just at the back of the rear arm hangers, and welding this frame clip on the back, I'll end up with an additional 24" wheelbase, which is perfect for the Brute cab + 80" stepside pickup bed. Probably I'll need to fabricate an additional mid-frame crossmember somewhere near the joint between the two frame halves to ensure enough rigidity.

The frame will also have to be lengthened about 9" directly in front of the rear crossmember to meet the rear of the pickup bed, and the eBay LJ frame has also yielded two 20" sections of straight frame rail, so no problem there. Also saved a couple of body mounts, these will probably come in handy for mounting the pickup bed.

Jeff

 

[jscherb]

the build has started...

In 1:25 scale at least :-)

I picked up a Revell die-cast Tomb Raider Rubicon kit and a Revell '41 Chevy stepside kit. I lengthened the frame a scale 34" (LJ length + 24"), and shortened the cab to the 61" dimension of the Brute cab. Unfortunately the Tomb Raider kit doesn't come with any kind of top, and only has half doors, so this model won't end up looking exactly like what I'll build, but it will give a good idea. Lots of work left to do on the model, including the interior, attaching the bed in the same location as my full scale plans call for, fabricating rear fenders, filling in the sides where I cut the tub, skirts under the bed, etc... but it's a start. Will look better with fenders, front flares and bed skirts. Stay tuned...

Jeff

PS: Thanks to Randyzzz for the model idea.

 

[Randyzzz]

Your beginning model already looks better that EBay thing! Lookin Good!

 

[bigwalton]

I love the research and drawings you do... the model just takes the cake.

I'd completely missed this thread until now, can't wait to watch (even the model coming together is awesome!)

 

[jscherb]

Thanks guys, I'll keep you posted on the "build" :-)

I'm going through this level of planning because:

a) I'm anal about that kind of thing
b) I can't actually start the build until the new garage is done, sometime in the spring
c) There won't be any surprises mid-build. I've got pretty much all the details planned, I know where to source every part (and I've collected many of them already), I know how things are going to come apart, how they'll go together, and what I need to fabricate. In fact I'm fabricating some of the parts now ahead of time, since I've gotten to enough level of design that I know what I need to fab.

Here's today's work on the build... got the interior in and working on smoothing the tub (may mix up some real bondo tomorrow). Unfortunately the roll cage in the kit is some goofy thing from Tomb Raider, oh well. Tomorrow I plan to fabricate rear fenders to match what I'm planning for the full size project.

Anyway, it is starting to look like a real vehicle and I'm happy with the look so far... it will look even better with fenders and flares...

 

[bigwalton]

I'd think there'd have to be a Wrangler kit with a normal rollbar and top that you could play with.

I always wanted to build an R/C jeep with a Postal Scrambler body including the World Cab... so I'm living vicariously through your photos. You ARE going to put it all on an R/C chassis when you're done fabbing it up, right?

 

[Randyzzz]

Costco had some die-cast Wranglers before Christmas for about 10 bucks- they had normal roll bars. OR...go to a hobby shop, buy some plastic stock and use heat to bend to shape.

 

[jscherb]

Here's today's build progress. Lowered the suspension a bit, there was way too much lift. Mounted bed at planned height and built bed skirts. Added front flares. Finished the rear frame extension, including rear bumper (TJ bumper looks nice with this bed, don't you think?) and fabricated a trailer hitch to match the one currently on my LJ. Fabricated rear fenders matching what I plan to use on my full scale project. Fabricated and installed side steps. Added "wood" side boards. Did a rough job finishing the sheet metal (more work on that later). Building this has been a lot of fun so far because I'm finding everything is falling into place exactly as I had planned in my drawings :-)

Work will now halt for about a week while I wait for deliveries from ebay auctions, I found two CJ-7 kits the same scale that will yield full doors, correct size tires (these are 34", I plan 31-32's), a more stock-looking roll bar, a soft top and a hard top, both to be modified to be half-cabs.

Also to be done is to paint everything red (that's the color of the LJ I'm starting with), and finding and mounting a spare on the driver's side of the bed.

Whaddya think, is this developing into something I really should build at 1:1 scale?

Jeff

 

[bigwalton]

Whaddya think, is this developing into something I really should build at 1:1 scale?

ABSOFRIGGINLOUTELY

 

[trust]

I've known some model builders to use the plastic molding sprue for roll bars and such but you may not be to exact scale. wouldn't bother me but may drive you nuts. Very impressive work, i really admire your efforts on this and can't wait to see the end product, both in full and scale models! Very nice indeed!!

 

[twmattox]

As usual, the stuff you are working on looks incredible. Just a couple thoughts...

That ebay rig looked like a small Jeep attached to a trailer. The problem I see (even with the Brute) is that the rear cab corners of the front don't flow with the front corners of the bed. It makes them visually look separate. In the drawings you did, you show square corners...but (for instance) in the ebay ad the corners were rounded. I guess I am saying it looks best for the intersecting corners to match (like your drawing).

Also, the other thing that would stand out to me is the use of black wheel guards (mud guards) on the front and the lack of them on the rear. Again, a small thing that would promote a more unified look in the rig.

Please don't mis-read these comments. I think what you are doing is phenomenal...and envious.