Another Scrambler Purchase/Road Trip - UPDATE- BODY ON FRAME AGAIN
- Thread starter spankrjs
- Start date
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Saturday update.
Used a longer jack handle, was able to press off 2nd gear and the 1/2 synchronizer hub. It was tight.
Parts that were pressed off, no damage.
Shaft repositioned in the press, removing the 3/4 synchronizer hub and the previously chipped 3rd gear. These parts pressed off much easier.
Last of the parts pressed off the main shaft.
Not the best pictures but a big difference between the two synchronizer hubs. The easier to press off 3/4 hub is made similar to the 5th gear, not continuous splines, maybe why it came off a bit easier then the the 1/2 hub.
The PIA 1/2 hub with continuous spline engagement.
All the internal parts, all need to be cleaned and inspected.
Initial case cleaning:
Serial/ID number:
Used a longer jack handle, was able to press off 2nd gear and the 1/2 synchronizer hub. It was tight.
Parts that were pressed off, no damage.
Shaft repositioned in the press, removing the 3/4 synchronizer hub and the previously chipped 3rd gear. These parts pressed off much easier.
Last of the parts pressed off the main shaft.
Not the best pictures but a big difference between the two synchronizer hubs. The easier to press off 3/4 hub is made similar to the 5th gear, not continuous splines, maybe why it came off a bit easier then the the 1/2 hub.
The PIA 1/2 hub with continuous spline engagement.
All the internal parts, all need to be cleaned and inspected.
Initial case cleaning:
Serial/ID number:
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Second round of case cleaning, and Initial cleaning of the center "slab".
And of course, got a little careless, the unsecured 5th gear shift rail slid out, and two little pieces fell out. Oh boy.
Reference pictures for me.
Now, looking through the manual, pretty sure these two parts fell out.
These can be the only parts that could have fell out. But, I was rinsing these parts off outside over a trash can, that luckily caught them. But, can't be 100% sure if these are the only parts that fell out. So, looks like I will be removing and reinstalling the shift rails to make sure I didn't lose any parts. Not the end of the world, and it will be easier to clean the center "slab".
But, I'm not taking anything else apart until I get all the previously removed parts cleaned, dried, lightly oiled, organized, and up off the floor.
And of course, got a little careless, the unsecured 5th gear shift rail slid out, and two little pieces fell out. Oh boy.
Reference pictures for me.
Now, looking through the manual, pretty sure these two parts fell out.
These can be the only parts that could have fell out. But, I was rinsing these parts off outside over a trash can, that luckily caught them. But, can't be 100% sure if these are the only parts that fell out. So, looks like I will be removing and reinstalling the shift rails to make sure I didn't lose any parts. Not the end of the world, and it will be easier to clean the center "slab".
But, I'm not taking anything else apart until I get all the previously removed parts cleaned, dried, lightly oiled, organized, and up off the floor.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
85% finished cleaning all the transmission parts.
Missing from the above picture are the two cases, center slab, shifter rails and forks. A bunch of damn parts!!
I should get my replacement 3rd gear (actually found a Mopar gear) and snap ring (Toyota) this week. Still thinking about input shaft options, I do have a replacement here.
That's it for now.
Missing from the above picture are the two cases, center slab, shifter rails and forks. A bunch of damn parts!!
I should get my replacement 3rd gear (actually found a Mopar gear) and snap ring (Toyota) this week. Still thinking about input shaft options, I do have a replacement here.
That's it for now.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Cleaning cases, mainly removing old sealant.
Putting some of this stuff on a rag, wiping it on the sealant, a little rubbing, working great.
A word of warning: this stuff is strong. I am wearing gloves, both garage doors open, but if I used this stuff more often, a filtered mask would be best. Potent, but does the job.
Fun!!!
For some reason I Grey RTV'd the living hell out of the Dana 300 adapter ring to the back of the transmission. No idea why, paying for it now, that is where all the Grey sealant came from.
One more part to disassemble, clean, reassemble, then I can finally start on putting the transmission back together.
You can see the remnants of some type of orange sealant/RTV on this center slab. Orange sealant on the case(s) to slab, black sealant on the front bearing retainer.
Waiting on my replacement lock ring, in the mail, then should have all my parts in hand.
That's it for now.
Putting some of this stuff on a rag, wiping it on the sealant, a little rubbing, working great.
A word of warning: this stuff is strong. I am wearing gloves, both garage doors open, but if I used this stuff more often, a filtered mask would be best. Potent, but does the job.
Fun!!!
For some reason I Grey RTV'd the living hell out of the Dana 300 adapter ring to the back of the transmission. No idea why, paying for it now, that is where all the Grey sealant came from.
One more part to disassemble, clean, reassemble, then I can finally start on putting the transmission back together.
You can see the remnants of some type of orange sealant/RTV on this center slab. Orange sealant on the case(s) to slab, black sealant on the front bearing retainer.
Waiting on my replacement lock ring, in the mail, then should have all my parts in hand.
That's it for now.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Alright, bunch of pictures and information and general BS from a somewhat productive weekend interrupted with periods of goofing off since the weather was so nice.
Friday night, shift rods still in place:
Following the directions in the FSM, shift rails removed:
And finally, the R151F/AX15 almost completely disassembled. One or two things I did not take apart, but 97% disassembled.
Shift rail small parts that came out of the intermediate plate. The three bolts are for the shift forks. I luckily did NOT lose any parts out in the yard.
Definitely NOT doing a step by step on putting this stuff back together. I followed the FSM and it wasn't terrible, not great either. If you have ever messed with the shift rails on a Dana 300, this is similar but so much worse. Follow the steps, patience is key, it will go back together. Cut away view of what you are doing.
When I removed the rails, I placed them in order, top to bottom, and in the same direction. Cardboard work table cover comes in handy if you are a redneck like me!!
FSM nomenclature: pin is small, plug is bigger.
And reassembled, per FSM. Just remember that bottom rail can slide out so be careful when handling this assembly!!
And it is much easier to clean the old sealant off this center slab without the rails in the way. So, don't be too scared to remove the shift rails.
I do disagree with one FSM recommendation: it says to use Vaseline to hold these little balls/pins in place while you try to assemble this stuff. No way. The parts will just fall out. So, I used my trusty old tub of this stuff, first purchased in 2010 when I rebuilt the original T176 this Scrambler came with. Even after quite a few T5 misadventures, still plenty left!!!
Stuff is thicker/stickier then petroleum jelly and will hold these small pieces in place while you fiddle fart around with them.
And the remaining shift rail/fork parts that will be reinstalled in much later steps.
Friday night, shift rods still in place:
Following the directions in the FSM, shift rails removed:
And finally, the R151F/AX15 almost completely disassembled. One or two things I did not take apart, but 97% disassembled.
Shift rail small parts that came out of the intermediate plate. The three bolts are for the shift forks. I luckily did NOT lose any parts out in the yard.
Definitely NOT doing a step by step on putting this stuff back together. I followed the FSM and it wasn't terrible, not great either. If you have ever messed with the shift rails on a Dana 300, this is similar but so much worse. Follow the steps, patience is key, it will go back together. Cut away view of what you are doing.
When I removed the rails, I placed them in order, top to bottom, and in the same direction. Cardboard work table cover comes in handy if you are a redneck like me!!
FSM nomenclature: pin is small, plug is bigger.
And reassembled, per FSM. Just remember that bottom rail can slide out so be careful when handling this assembly!!
And it is much easier to clean the old sealant off this center slab without the rails in the way. So, don't be too scared to remove the shift rails.
I do disagree with one FSM recommendation: it says to use Vaseline to hold these little balls/pins in place while you try to assemble this stuff. No way. The parts will just fall out. So, I used my trusty old tub of this stuff, first purchased in 2010 when I rebuilt the original T176 this Scrambler came with. Even after quite a few T5 misadventures, still plenty left!!!
Stuff is thicker/stickier then petroleum jelly and will hold these small pieces in place while you fiddle fart around with them.
And the remaining shift rail/fork parts that will be reinstalled in much later steps.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
I was so happy/tired after I got the shift rails reinstalled, got a little careless when reinstalling the shift rail clips, and one pinged off into the great unknown recesses of the garage.
I spent about 3 hours Friday night looking for it with no luck. Went to bed disgusted with myself for being so careless.
Got up Saturday morning, washed the green Scrambler, took one last look around, found the damn clip under the table holding all the other transmission parts. Better to be lucky then good sometimes........
Did a happy dance for sure after finding it. Small parts like this will be pretty tough to purchase. Mopar/Jeep has pretty much discontinued any AX15 parts. Toyota is your best bet for odd parts like this, or a junk transmission.
This is the contents of the rebuild kit I purchased off eBay. A few seals and parts you won't use (2wd applications). The bearings were all high quality made in Japan stuff, matching OEM. The other parts seamed just fine, too.
I'm not going to do a step by step, but these are my pictures/notes. I basically followed the FSM.
My biggest advice: pay very close attention to the orientation of all parts during assembly. Also, take your time matching up your new parts with the old, to make sure they will work. Be very detail focused. Laying all the parts out, in order, like I did, will help out.
Pressing the new input shaft bearing into position. Make sure the clip groove is facing out. Note direction.
These are the five new blocking rings. Two are big, the other three are smaller. IIRC the two larger rings are identical. The three smaller ones have some differences, very slight. I matched up the old to the exact new ring. Be careful here.
Two larger rings, not used here. IIRC these are for first and second gear.
Anyway, the assembled input shaft and it's associated parts. It can be stored away for now.
I spent about 3 hours Friday night looking for it with no luck. Went to bed disgusted with myself for being so careless.
Got up Saturday morning, washed the green Scrambler, took one last look around, found the damn clip under the table holding all the other transmission parts. Better to be lucky then good sometimes........
Did a happy dance for sure after finding it. Small parts like this will be pretty tough to purchase. Mopar/Jeep has pretty much discontinued any AX15 parts. Toyota is your best bet for odd parts like this, or a junk transmission.
This is the contents of the rebuild kit I purchased off eBay. A few seals and parts you won't use (2wd applications). The bearings were all high quality made in Japan stuff, matching OEM. The other parts seamed just fine, too.
I'm not going to do a step by step, but these are my pictures/notes. I basically followed the FSM.
My biggest advice: pay very close attention to the orientation of all parts during assembly. Also, take your time matching up your new parts with the old, to make sure they will work. Be very detail focused. Laying all the parts out, in order, like I did, will help out.
Pressing the new input shaft bearing into position. Make sure the clip groove is facing out. Note direction.
These are the five new blocking rings. Two are big, the other three are smaller. IIRC the two larger rings are identical. The three smaller ones have some differences, very slight. I matched up the old to the exact new ring. Be careful here.
Two larger rings, not used here. IIRC these are for first and second gear.
Anyway, the assembled input shaft and it's associated parts. It can be stored away for now.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Cluster gear front bearing and associated parts. Note that spacer that goes between the front bearing and the forward most gear. IIRC the FSM does not reference it, or the center sleeve that slides between the ID of the rollers and the cluster gear journal.
Pressing the front bearing on.
Note that the clip groove on the bearing faces toward the front.
I did not realize that my cluster gear front bearing lock ring got slightly deformed during removal. So, I fixed it.
I used the press to get it close, which is overkill. I ended up fine tuning it with a curved pair of vice grips, worked perfect. Now, if the lock ring is all mangled up I would not attempt this. Or, if it is cracked/twisted. Mine just needed a little love. This ring was still the correct thickness when installed in its groove, tight fit.
Front of cluster gear, bearing and associated parts pressed on. Lock ring installed. Outer ring next to the assembly. This assembly can also be stored away for now.
Moving along, following the FSM steps, installed two seals next. Below is an alternate part number for the front bearing retainer seal if you screw up the one included with the rebuild kit. I wouldn't know anything about that....
And the seal installed.
Note the depth that this seal is installed. Do NOT install it all the way down, or even much below this depth. You want the seal installed right to the bottom of the chamfer on the plate.
This is how the original seal was installed. On my first attempt, I drove it in too deep. I did a test fit of the parts installed into the case, used grease on the input shaft, and the outer part of the seal was barely on the seal surface of the shaft. It is hard to drive the seal back out without damaging it. Be careful here!!!
I also installed the rear case output shaft seal, didn't take a picture. I installed it to the same depth the original seal was installed. Neither of these seals leaked with over 70k miles so that must be the correct depths.
Moving along, next up is third gear and the associated 3rd/4th gear synchronizer assembly.
I had to purchase a new third gear because I chipped a tooth when I was removing another part when I was disassembling the main shaft. Be careful!! Also in the below picture is the new Toyota lock ring to replace the original ring that was damaged during disassembly.
Pressing the front bearing on.
Note that the clip groove on the bearing faces toward the front.
I did not realize that my cluster gear front bearing lock ring got slightly deformed during removal. So, I fixed it.
I used the press to get it close, which is overkill. I ended up fine tuning it with a curved pair of vice grips, worked perfect. Now, if the lock ring is all mangled up I would not attempt this. Or, if it is cracked/twisted. Mine just needed a little love. This ring was still the correct thickness when installed in its groove, tight fit.
Front of cluster gear, bearing and associated parts pressed on. Lock ring installed. Outer ring next to the assembly. This assembly can also be stored away for now.
Moving along, following the FSM steps, installed two seals next. Below is an alternate part number for the front bearing retainer seal if you screw up the one included with the rebuild kit. I wouldn't know anything about that....
And the seal installed.
Note the depth that this seal is installed. Do NOT install it all the way down, or even much below this depth. You want the seal installed right to the bottom of the chamfer on the plate.
This is how the original seal was installed. On my first attempt, I drove it in too deep. I did a test fit of the parts installed into the case, used grease on the input shaft, and the outer part of the seal was barely on the seal surface of the shaft. It is hard to drive the seal back out without damaging it. Be careful here!!!
I also installed the rear case output shaft seal, didn't take a picture. I installed it to the same depth the original seal was installed. Neither of these seals leaked with over 70k miles so that must be the correct depths.
Moving along, next up is third gear and the associated 3rd/4th gear synchronizer assembly.
I had to purchase a new third gear because I chipped a tooth when I was removing another part when I was disassembling the main shaft. Be careful!! Also in the below picture is the new Toyota lock ring to replace the original ring that was damaged during disassembly.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
This is where being OCD pays off. In the picture below, the original blocking ring is on the bottom (still had OEM green paint on it!!!), replacement on top of it.
If you look closely, the new ring on top, little teeth on the side, are shaped like little houses. The original ring side teeth are slightly different, have a larger "ramp" on one side of the "house" vs the other side.
Original third gear below:
Note how it's side teeth match the original blocking rings side teeth, more of a ramp up on one side vs the other.
Replacement third gear:
Note how the new gear has even ramps on both sides of the little side teeth, matching up with the new blocking ring.
That's all fine and well, and you can Google, if you want to learn more, about third gear revisions. My transmission is a Toyota, so some of the Jeep revisions may or may not apply. My transmission, I believe, more closely matches up with an early Jeep AX15, as opposed to some of the later year Jeep versions.
I am going to use the new gear with the new blocking ring, they match. So, guess I was lucky I chipped a tooth off my original 3rd gear? I'm not an expert, maybe the new ring would work with the old style gear???? I do know that my original 3rd gear and blocking ring were the only gear/blocking ring to have the asymmetrical little "houses ". All my other OEM parts have symmetrical "houses".
Another picture of my new Mopar replacement third gear box lable.
It would be interesting to know where in the revisions order this number falls into.
I never had any issues at all with my original 3rd gear shifting performance, hope the same holds true with my new set up. Better to be lucky then good, again, I hope....... Won't know until I drive it.
Assembled the 3rd/4th synchronizer assembly (3 little teeth, two clips), no picture. Just make sure the little clips are 180 degrees apart, front to back.
This picture shows the FRONT facing ends of both the center hub and the sliding sleeve. Be very careful with orientation/direction.
I made marks on the outside of the sliding sleeve to help me align the little teeth inside with the corresponding notches of the brass blocking rings. Again, be careful, don't want to smash stuff when assembling things.
Pressing on the 3rd/4th synchronizer assembly. Third gear slides on first, then press on the hub, make sure to align the fingers with the notches in the brass blocking ring.
Next up is second gear, and it's associated parts.
These parts slide on.
Again, spend some time matching up the old/new brass blocking rings. The needle bearing assemblies that go inside the gears are all obviously different sizes, so hard to screw them up.
If you look closely, the new ring on top, little teeth on the side, are shaped like little houses. The original ring side teeth are slightly different, have a larger "ramp" on one side of the "house" vs the other side.
Original third gear below:
Note how it's side teeth match the original blocking rings side teeth, more of a ramp up on one side vs the other.
Replacement third gear:
Note how the new gear has even ramps on both sides of the little side teeth, matching up with the new blocking ring.
That's all fine and well, and you can Google, if you want to learn more, about third gear revisions. My transmission is a Toyota, so some of the Jeep revisions may or may not apply. My transmission, I believe, more closely matches up with an early Jeep AX15, as opposed to some of the later year Jeep versions.
I am going to use the new gear with the new blocking ring, they match. So, guess I was lucky I chipped a tooth off my original 3rd gear? I'm not an expert, maybe the new ring would work with the old style gear???? I do know that my original 3rd gear and blocking ring were the only gear/blocking ring to have the asymmetrical little "houses ". All my other OEM parts have symmetrical "houses".
Another picture of my new Mopar replacement third gear box lable.
It would be interesting to know where in the revisions order this number falls into.
I never had any issues at all with my original 3rd gear shifting performance, hope the same holds true with my new set up. Better to be lucky then good, again, I hope....... Won't know until I drive it.
Assembled the 3rd/4th synchronizer assembly (3 little teeth, two clips), no picture. Just make sure the little clips are 180 degrees apart, front to back.
This picture shows the FRONT facing ends of both the center hub and the sliding sleeve. Be very careful with orientation/direction.
I made marks on the outside of the sliding sleeve to help me align the little teeth inside with the corresponding notches of the brass blocking rings. Again, be careful, don't want to smash stuff when assembling things.
Pressing on the 3rd/4th synchronizer assembly. Third gear slides on first, then press on the hub, make sure to align the fingers with the notches in the brass blocking ring.
Next up is second gear, and it's associated parts.
These parts slide on.
Again, spend some time matching up the old/new brass blocking rings. The needle bearing assemblies that go inside the gears are all obviously different sizes, so hard to screw them up.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
This is the 1st/2nd synchronizer hub face. Note the chamfer on the internal splines.
Note the FSM.
Again, OCD pays off, especially when disassembling. Takes lots of notes and pictures.
Took a break, had to go to the shop at work to cut a press pipe. It is nice having access to stuff like this!!
Using oil on the blade while it's cutting, no weight added to the arm, this old thing will cut straight and true.
Picture above shows the cut side against the table saw rip guide. Looks pretty damn good to me!! This galvanized steel pipe I am using is 1/8" sidewall thickness, should make a great press tube.
Pressing on the 1st/2nd synchronizer hub onto the main shaft with my new press pipe.
Even with a helper it would have been next to impossible to flip the assembly and press it on the other way. You would be trying to hold up on the heavy gear/needle bearing assmebly while also trying to keep the blocking ring notches aligned with the synchronizer fingers. And, you would be trying to hold up on stuff in a gap that is closing as you press the parts together. This worked perfectly for me.
As noted on the other synchronizer assembly, I marked where the fingers are located to ensure they would fall inside the brass blocking ring notches.
Installed the original locking ring, still a perfect tight fit so no need for a new lock ring here.
First gear parts slide on next.
Installed, note the hole in main shaft directly behind first gear.
I installed a stronger first gear thrust washer and pin, per Wisconsin Ron's directive. I sourced these parts from Marlin Cawler. They work on Toyota and Jeep AX15 transmissions.
OEM on left, upgrade on right. The upgraded washer is made out of stronger metal and also note how it has a rounded locating peg notch vs the OEM square notch. This part is known to fail, probably more so with V8 power. Anyway, cheap insurance while I am in here anyway....
Note the FSM.
Again, OCD pays off, especially when disassembling. Takes lots of notes and pictures.
Took a break, had to go to the shop at work to cut a press pipe. It is nice having access to stuff like this!!
Using oil on the blade while it's cutting, no weight added to the arm, this old thing will cut straight and true.
Picture above shows the cut side against the table saw rip guide. Looks pretty damn good to me!! This galvanized steel pipe I am using is 1/8" sidewall thickness, should make a great press tube.
Pressing on the 1st/2nd synchronizer hub onto the main shaft with my new press pipe.
Even with a helper it would have been next to impossible to flip the assembly and press it on the other way. You would be trying to hold up on the heavy gear/needle bearing assmebly while also trying to keep the blocking ring notches aligned with the synchronizer fingers. And, you would be trying to hold up on stuff in a gap that is closing as you press the parts together. This worked perfectly for me.
As noted on the other synchronizer assembly, I marked where the fingers are located to ensure they would fall inside the brass blocking ring notches.
Installed the original locking ring, still a perfect tight fit so no need for a new lock ring here.
First gear parts slide on next.
Installed, note the hole in main shaft directly behind first gear.
I installed a stronger first gear thrust washer and pin, per Wisconsin Ron's directive. I sourced these parts from Marlin Cawler. They work on Toyota and Jeep AX15 transmissions.
OEM on left, upgrade on right. The upgraded washer is made out of stronger metal and also note how it has a rounded locating peg notch vs the OEM square notch. This part is known to fail, probably more so with V8 power. Anyway, cheap insurance while I am in here anyway....
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Thrust washer installed. I used some of the transmission assembly lube to hold the little peg in place. Bearing ready to press on.
Pressing the rear bearing on. Note that the retainer clip groove on the bearing faces the REAR of the shaft.
Fifth gear and it's corresponding clip are up next. Note the directions this gear goes on. (Not sure if it is correct in below picture)
Pressing 5th gear on to the main shaft.
Installed the snap ring, it is a tad loose. (needs to be a hair fatter)
My original locking ring was an "H". It measured in at 3.12mm. I can probably jam a "K" in there, maybe. To be safe, I ordered an "I" and a "K" from Toyota. So, waiting on parts....
A few random notes I took while installing all of these parts. I checked the clearances as directed by the FSM.
First and second gear clearances:
2nd gear a hair looser then first, but still within the specifications.
The new 3rd gear clearance:
Brand new gear, tight clearance. Kind of neat to see how the thrust faces of the gears do actually wear with use. Once they get too loose, unfortunately, time for a new gear, no way to shim them.
My transmission worked perfect before I took it apart, no complaints at all, sure hope it still does when I'm finished!!
My original bearings were still tight, but I did change them. All my brass blocking rings were still in great shape, side "teeth" and the little "brake ridges" on the inside of them.
So, besides the input shaft that was damaged due to pilot bearing/bushing issues, and me chipping 3rd gear, no damage or abnormal wear inside this transmission. It was new when I bought it, I put 70,000+ miles on it, no complaints. I have not really abused the transmission, but I do use this Jeep, probably harder then a lot of people. Besides off road use, it was nothing for me to drive this Scrambler for 12 plus hours straight on the interstate. All in all, it was a good choice. If not for the input shaft issues, I would say that this transmission would have easily lasted me at least 200k miles before needing a rebuild. A much needed upgrade over the T5's I had in here.
So, waiting on some lock rings. Assembled parts out of the way inside the new work bench for safe keeping:
Parts table a little lighter!!!
A few quick notes:
1) I am lightly lubing all parts with the Valvoline MTL I have been and will continue to use inside this transmission. It is yellow metal safe, and must be doing a great job, no complaints. Note the word "lightly" lubing. Don't get carried away, you still have to glue the cases to the center slab. You don't want excess lube dripping into your sealant before it cures!!!
2) I have been using the press to install these parts. Mine is just 12 tons, seems more then adequate. I am lubing all the pressure contact surfaces before pressing the parts together. Everything pressed on just fine, no problems or excessive force needed. I would say it has been easier to reassemble then disassemble.
3) Hopefully, after all this trouble and time, this damn thing works perfectly!!! If not, I'll throw the T176 back in this Scrambler and learn to drive slower LOL. I never did have any issues out of the T176........
That's it for now.
Pressing the rear bearing on. Note that the retainer clip groove on the bearing faces the REAR of the shaft.
Fifth gear and it's corresponding clip are up next. Note the directions this gear goes on. (Not sure if it is correct in below picture)
Pressing 5th gear on to the main shaft.
Installed the snap ring, it is a tad loose. (needs to be a hair fatter)
My original locking ring was an "H". It measured in at 3.12mm. I can probably jam a "K" in there, maybe. To be safe, I ordered an "I" and a "K" from Toyota. So, waiting on parts....
A few random notes I took while installing all of these parts. I checked the clearances as directed by the FSM.
First and second gear clearances:
2nd gear a hair looser then first, but still within the specifications.
The new 3rd gear clearance:
Brand new gear, tight clearance. Kind of neat to see how the thrust faces of the gears do actually wear with use. Once they get too loose, unfortunately, time for a new gear, no way to shim them.
My transmission worked perfect before I took it apart, no complaints at all, sure hope it still does when I'm finished!!
My original bearings were still tight, but I did change them. All my brass blocking rings were still in great shape, side "teeth" and the little "brake ridges" on the inside of them.
So, besides the input shaft that was damaged due to pilot bearing/bushing issues, and me chipping 3rd gear, no damage or abnormal wear inside this transmission. It was new when I bought it, I put 70,000+ miles on it, no complaints. I have not really abused the transmission, but I do use this Jeep, probably harder then a lot of people. Besides off road use, it was nothing for me to drive this Scrambler for 12 plus hours straight on the interstate. All in all, it was a good choice. If not for the input shaft issues, I would say that this transmission would have easily lasted me at least 200k miles before needing a rebuild. A much needed upgrade over the T5's I had in here.
So, waiting on some lock rings. Assembled parts out of the way inside the new work bench for safe keeping:
Parts table a little lighter!!!
A few quick notes:
1) I am lightly lubing all parts with the Valvoline MTL I have been and will continue to use inside this transmission. It is yellow metal safe, and must be doing a great job, no complaints. Note the word "lightly" lubing. Don't get carried away, you still have to glue the cases to the center slab. You don't want excess lube dripping into your sealant before it cures!!!
2) I have been using the press to install these parts. Mine is just 12 tons, seems more then adequate. I am lubing all the pressure contact surfaces before pressing the parts together. Everything pressed on just fine, no problems or excessive force needed. I would say it has been easier to reassemble then disassemble.
3) Hopefully, after all this trouble and time, this damn thing works perfectly!!! If not, I'll throw the T176 back in this Scrambler and learn to drive slower LOL. I never did have any issues out of the T176........
That's it for now.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
The online Toyota place I ordered the two 5th gear snap rings from yesterday, contacted me today, and of course they don't have them/can't get them, even though they said they did yesterday, waste of time 
I called the local Toyota dealer this afternoon, they said that the California warehouse has the two clips in stock, so I ordered the two clips from them. Only bad thing, they probably won't get here until next week, which is fine, I really do not have a choice
Called the local Jeep dealer, and of course, like all of my other AX15 parts inquiries, they are discontinued.
The bad thing about all of this: I need to install one of these two clips, first, to finish the main shaft.
Then, I can reinstall the balance of the parts on the countershaft AND hope that my selective fit snap rings there will still work, or more waiting games if I have to order more parts from Toyota.......................................
I COULD maybe reinstall the rest of the counter shaft parts now, BEFORE the new snap rings show up. The only problem with this: those snap rings are a bitch to put on, I used a brass drift and a hammer to tap it on. I hate to do this with the countershaft installed because then you are smacking gear teeth on gear teeth. I'll take a look, MAYBE I can install the clip with a big pair of plyers negating any smacking of assembled expensive parts with a hammer..................
But, I can still go ahead and check the bellhousing run out, install the clutch, clean up the Dana 300, so I do have some other work i can take care of while I wait on parts.
I called the local Toyota dealer this afternoon, they said that the California warehouse has the two clips in stock, so I ordered the two clips from them. Only bad thing, they probably won't get here until next week, which is fine, I really do not have a choice
Called the local Jeep dealer, and of course, like all of my other AX15 parts inquiries, they are discontinued.
The bad thing about all of this: I need to install one of these two clips, first, to finish the main shaft.
Then, I can reinstall the balance of the parts on the countershaft AND hope that my selective fit snap rings there will still work, or more waiting games if I have to order more parts from Toyota.......................................
I COULD maybe reinstall the rest of the counter shaft parts now, BEFORE the new snap rings show up. The only problem with this: those snap rings are a bitch to put on, I used a brass drift and a hammer to tap it on. I hate to do this with the countershaft installed because then you are smacking gear teeth on gear teeth. I'll take a look, MAYBE I can install the clip with a big pair of plyers negating any smacking of assembled expensive parts with a hammer..................
But, I can still go ahead and check the bellhousing run out, install the clutch, clean up the Dana 300, so I do have some other work i can take care of while I wait on parts.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
One step forward, two steps back, but an interesting discovery.
I ordered some new dowel pins when I first took the transmission out. My original pins did not really look too bad but......
When I put a caliper on the new dowels vs the old dowels, the old ones were around 3-4 thousandths skinnier. The new dowels fit snug and secure in the bellhousing. Not really a smoking gun, but it is a little bit of slack.
I removed the old dowels pins with the engine spacer plate in place, and the flywheel in place. If I would have known the other issue I was about to find I would have pulled the flywheel and the spacer plate first.
Anyway, pulled the spacer plate out after pulling the dowel pins. I wanted to really clean this plate up, and the corresponding block mating surface.
Got the plate down and cleaned up:
And noticed this damage at both dowel pin locating holes:
I have never really noticed this before. Not sure how it happened, I have never used an impact on the bellhousing bolts, the bolts have never backed out/became loose to cause this???
So, in the past I have checked the center of crank to center of bellhousing bore, and was always in spec. I never checked to see if the transmission face of the bellhousing was parallel to the engine block. With that aluminum plate being damaged at both lower holes, makes me think that maybe the bellhousing was pulled in a bit more at the bottom then the top causing the two surfaces to not be parallel. I always torque the bellhousing bolts to spec, but maybe even the factory torque could cause the bellhousing to stretch to the block, causing a misalignment?
Anyway, ordered a new Omix powder coated steel plate. Hopefully it is decent enough, I don't have a spare plate and I figured any used plate I could scrounge up might have similar or different damage.
Going to pull the flywheel off, while I'm at it, really no way to ensure the block is 100% clean. Will clean everything up, installed the new dowel pins, new plate when it shows up, and the bellhousing and then check the concentric and parallel run out.
Crazy. But, maybe this has been an issue all along. But I wonder how many other people are driving around in CJ's (or other vehicles with soft aluminum spacer plates) that have minor damage like this without any issues?
Who knows.
I ordered some new dowel pins when I first took the transmission out. My original pins did not really look too bad but......
When I put a caliper on the new dowels vs the old dowels, the old ones were around 3-4 thousandths skinnier. The new dowels fit snug and secure in the bellhousing. Not really a smoking gun, but it is a little bit of slack.
I removed the old dowels pins with the engine spacer plate in place, and the flywheel in place. If I would have known the other issue I was about to find I would have pulled the flywheel and the spacer plate first.
Anyway, pulled the spacer plate out after pulling the dowel pins. I wanted to really clean this plate up, and the corresponding block mating surface.
Got the plate down and cleaned up:
And noticed this damage at both dowel pin locating holes:
I have never really noticed this before. Not sure how it happened, I have never used an impact on the bellhousing bolts, the bolts have never backed out/became loose to cause this???
So, in the past I have checked the center of crank to center of bellhousing bore, and was always in spec. I never checked to see if the transmission face of the bellhousing was parallel to the engine block. With that aluminum plate being damaged at both lower holes, makes me think that maybe the bellhousing was pulled in a bit more at the bottom then the top causing the two surfaces to not be parallel. I always torque the bellhousing bolts to spec, but maybe even the factory torque could cause the bellhousing to stretch to the block, causing a misalignment?
Anyway, ordered a new Omix powder coated steel plate. Hopefully it is decent enough, I don't have a spare plate and I figured any used plate I could scrounge up might have similar or different damage.
Going to pull the flywheel off, while I'm at it, really no way to ensure the block is 100% clean. Will clean everything up, installed the new dowel pins, new plate when it shows up, and the bellhousing and then check the concentric and parallel run out.
Crazy. But, maybe this has been an issue all along. But I wonder how many other people are driving around in CJ's (or other vehicles with soft aluminum spacer plates) that have minor damage like this without any issues?
Who knows.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
My new transmission snap rings arrived at the Toyota dealership sooner than expected, pleasant surprise!!!
And my new spacer plate arrived on time, too!!
Not all fun and games. Decided to remove the flywheel to enable a bit easier engine block cleaning and ended up rounding off one of the flywheel bolt heads with the impact. My fault, got in a hurry, did not pay enough attention. Went to the store and obtained a stripped bolt head bolt socket, got it out, after a little map gas heat, so happy about that.
I don't know why I decided to use these thin head bolts, I am going to install the original thick head bolts. It is way to easy to round off the corners on these thin head bolts.
So, got the flywheel off, cleaned the engine block and bellhousing, and installed the bell housing with the bolts torqued to spec, ready to check the center bore runout and check to ensure the block and transmission mounting face of the bell housing are parallel.
I placed a piece of tape over the spring attaching slot/hole in the face of the bellhousing to keep the dial indicator stylus from getting hung up.
I checked the face, and then the center bore runout. According to the FSM as long as the runout is less then .01 you are good.
My results, which I found interesting:
F = face runout
C = center bore runout
Interesting that both the face and center bore were out the most in the same location.
I zeroed the indicator at the "Start 0" location, about one o'clock. I went -7 for the face, and -9 for the center bore. These were my lowest spots, I never went high, or above zero.
Anyway, half of 7 thousandths equals .0035, and half of 9 thousandths equals .0045, both well below the allowed maximum of .01. So, happy about this. I was confident I was in spec, but doesn't hurt to check. It would have been interesting to check with the damaged spacer plate, maybe it would have thrown me out of spec??
Anyway, clear conscious, I can get on down the road with this project.
That's it for now!!
And my new spacer plate arrived on time, too!!
Not all fun and games. Decided to remove the flywheel to enable a bit easier engine block cleaning and ended up rounding off one of the flywheel bolt heads with the impact. My fault, got in a hurry, did not pay enough attention. Went to the store and obtained a stripped bolt head bolt socket, got it out, after a little map gas heat, so happy about that.
I don't know why I decided to use these thin head bolts, I am going to install the original thick head bolts. It is way to easy to round off the corners on these thin head bolts.
So, got the flywheel off, cleaned the engine block and bellhousing, and installed the bell housing with the bolts torqued to spec, ready to check the center bore runout and check to ensure the block and transmission mounting face of the bell housing are parallel.
I placed a piece of tape over the spring attaching slot/hole in the face of the bellhousing to keep the dial indicator stylus from getting hung up.
I checked the face, and then the center bore runout. According to the FSM as long as the runout is less then .01 you are good.
My results, which I found interesting:
F = face runout
C = center bore runout
Interesting that both the face and center bore were out the most in the same location.
I zeroed the indicator at the "Start 0" location, about one o'clock. I went -7 for the face, and -9 for the center bore. These were my lowest spots, I never went high, or above zero.
Anyway, half of 7 thousandths equals .0035, and half of 9 thousandths equals .0045, both well below the allowed maximum of .01. So, happy about this. I was confident I was in spec, but doesn't hurt to check. It would have been interesting to check with the damaged spacer plate, maybe it would have thrown me out of spec??
Anyway, clear conscious, I can get on down the road with this project.
That's it for now!!
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Worked on this one most of the day today, made pretty good progress.
Started out under the Jeep, where I left off last night. I used two 1/2" fine thread bolts, washers, and a steel plate to pull the pilot bushing into the crank bore. Just make sure you don't thread the bolts all the way through. I would tighten the bolts, gentle tap with a hammer/block of wood, worked well.
And installed. This bushing has been soaking in oil for a couple of weeks so it is about as saturated with oil as it can get.
Used a piece of felt, soaked in oil, made a pilot bushing oil wick like I did with my green Scrambler awhile back.
Left the old input shaft inside the bushing for a few minutes, pulled it out, hard to see but a nice light oil coating left on the tip.
Used the old input shaft as a clutch disc alignment tool, clutch installation finished.
Back to transmission reassembly. I ended up using the fatter of the two 5th gear snap rings, super tight fit as it should be.
Greased up the new input shaft internal roller bearing, ready to install on the front of the mainshaft.
Rear counter shaft bearing installed in the center slab, counter shaft installed inside the bearing. Thin coat of oil on outside of the bearing allows for easy slip fit installation.
Mainshaft installed. Kind of fiddle doing this. Best to barely have countershaft bearing in the bore, work in the mainshaft, kind of turn the gears to mesh, it will go in.
Keeping the bearing snap rings organized.
Started out under the Jeep, where I left off last night. I used two 1/2" fine thread bolts, washers, and a steel plate to pull the pilot bushing into the crank bore. Just make sure you don't thread the bolts all the way through. I would tighten the bolts, gentle tap with a hammer/block of wood, worked well.
And installed. This bushing has been soaking in oil for a couple of weeks so it is about as saturated with oil as it can get.
Used a piece of felt, soaked in oil, made a pilot bushing oil wick like I did with my green Scrambler awhile back.
Left the old input shaft inside the bushing for a few minutes, pulled it out, hard to see but a nice light oil coating left on the tip.
Used the old input shaft as a clutch disc alignment tool, clutch installation finished.
Back to transmission reassembly. I ended up using the fatter of the two 5th gear snap rings, super tight fit as it should be.
Greased up the new input shaft internal roller bearing, ready to install on the front of the mainshaft.
Rear counter shaft bearing installed in the center slab, counter shaft installed inside the bearing. Thin coat of oil on outside of the bearing allows for easy slip fit installation.
Mainshaft installed. Kind of fiddle doing this. Best to barely have countershaft bearing in the bore, work in the mainshaft, kind of turn the gears to mesh, it will go in.
Keeping the bearing snap rings organized.
- City
- Biloxi
- State
- MS
Rear bearing snap rings installed.
Bought and installed a Marlin Crawler upgraded rear bearing retainer plate. Way beefier then the OEM plate.
Installed. I used blue lock tite on all of these internal bolts. I found evidence of this being used from the OEM assembly.
Don't forget to install the reverse gear with the reverse shaft while you are installing the rear bearing plate. Note gear orientation.
I had to use a hand file inside this notch in the shaft to enable the new Marlin Crawler plate to fit inside. Maybe 1 minute with a flat hand file.
This rear bearing plate is a tight fit, as it should be. You have to hold up on the two gear shafts when installing the plate so that it will rest flat against the slab. A little fiddly but not terrible. I did not want to pull the plate into position with the bolts. Just have to work it a bit but easy enough.
I marked this bolt, I might have to file it to clear the rear case. I will know later on.
Was pretty happy until I realized I forgot to install the 1-2 and 3-4 shift forks on the shift rails, so had to pull it all back apart!!!
And all reinstalled, again.
A little bit more fiddly with the shift forks involved. What I found easiest: install the mainshaft first, making sure the forks engage the shift collars, then install the counter shaft. Leave the bearings about half way in the bores, kind of go in at an angle, rotate the shafts to mesh the teeth, it will go. Shouldn't have to force it, patience is key.
Close up of shift fork orientation. I used blue lock tite on these bolts, too.
Bought and installed a Marlin Crawler upgraded rear bearing retainer plate. Way beefier then the OEM plate.
Installed. I used blue lock tite on all of these internal bolts. I found evidence of this being used from the OEM assembly.
Don't forget to install the reverse gear with the reverse shaft while you are installing the rear bearing plate. Note gear orientation.
I had to use a hand file inside this notch in the shaft to enable the new Marlin Crawler plate to fit inside. Maybe 1 minute with a flat hand file.
This rear bearing plate is a tight fit, as it should be. You have to hold up on the two gear shafts when installing the plate so that it will rest flat against the slab. A little fiddly but not terrible. I did not want to pull the plate into position with the bolts. Just have to work it a bit but easy enough.
I marked this bolt, I might have to file it to clear the rear case. I will know later on.
Was pretty happy until I realized I forgot to install the 1-2 and 3-4 shift forks on the shift rails, so had to pull it all back apart!!!
And all reinstalled, again.
A little bit more fiddly with the shift forks involved. What I found easiest: install the mainshaft first, making sure the forks engage the shift collars, then install the counter shaft. Leave the bearings about half way in the bores, kind of go in at an angle, rotate the shafts to mesh the teeth, it will go. Shouldn't have to force it, patience is key.
Close up of shift fork orientation. I used blue lock tite on these bolts, too.