jallan
Jallan
- City
- Gulfport
- State
- MS
OT: Retro Wrangler/Willys Pickup (long)
- Thread starter jscherb
- Start date
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
Are you guys familiar with Vintage Trucks magazine? Always great articles about old trucks, they even did a good article on CJ-8 World Cabs (April 06) and CJ-10 export pickups (May 05).
Anyway... they run a feature every issue called "Model Maker's Corner", always covering some aspect of model building related to old trucks. I sent the editor some photos of the Retro Wrangler and the Willys models along with a draft article and he was enthusiastic about publishing it. I'll let you know when it runs, it is published 6 times a year so might be some months before it appears in print. Now I've got to go take some magazine-quality photos of the models...
A small design update: one of the things I wasn't completely happy with was the spare on the bed side. The full size spare just stuck out too far - you can check the photos earlier in the thread and you can see how far it sticks out. Below is a photo of the fix. I decided since I haven't used a spare on the road in maybe 20 years, I would go with a T155D90/16 compact spare, as used in the Grand Cherokee. This is only about 5 1/2" thick, instead of 12" for the full size tire. It is also 27" diameter instead of 32". This one looks right at home on the bed side, and it doesn't stick out past the rear fender. And I think it looks much more like the old Willys this way. Already found the right size rim and tire at the Pick-N-Pull for $9, never used :-) Will probably have to have a tire cover custom made, though, since most space-saver spares are inside the vehicles. Can leave it uncovered, it will look too strange.
And a build update: I've ordered the parts for the 2" lift for the Unlimited, and found some Rubicon Moab 16" wheels at a good price, so in the next few weeks the Unlimited will be lifted and get 32" Wrangler RT/S tires. A small first step in the actual build that I can do before I get the garage done in the new house.
Jeff
Anyway... they run a feature every issue called "Model Maker's Corner", always covering some aspect of model building related to old trucks. I sent the editor some photos of the Retro Wrangler and the Willys models along with a draft article and he was enthusiastic about publishing it. I'll let you know when it runs, it is published 6 times a year so might be some months before it appears in print. Now I've got to go take some magazine-quality photos of the models...
A small design update: one of the things I wasn't completely happy with was the spare on the bed side. The full size spare just stuck out too far - you can check the photos earlier in the thread and you can see how far it sticks out. Below is a photo of the fix. I decided since I haven't used a spare on the road in maybe 20 years, I would go with a T155D90/16 compact spare, as used in the Grand Cherokee. This is only about 5 1/2" thick, instead of 12" for the full size tire. It is also 27" diameter instead of 32". This one looks right at home on the bed side, and it doesn't stick out past the rear fender. And I think it looks much more like the old Willys this way. Already found the right size rim and tire at the Pick-N-Pull for $9, never used :-) Will probably have to have a tire cover custom made, though, since most space-saver spares are inside the vehicles. Can leave it uncovered, it will look too strange.
And a build update: I've ordered the parts for the 2" lift for the Unlimited, and found some Rubicon Moab 16" wheels at a good price, so in the next few weeks the Unlimited will be lifted and get 32" Wrangler RT/S tires. A small first step in the actual build that I can do before I get the garage done in the new house.
Jeff
- City
- Dexter
- State
- MI
That's VERY cool on the model thing... are they going to do something on the entire build that follows? That seems like the logical thing for them to do.
Do you have a copy of the World Cab article? I'd love to have it, I've never heard of the mag or the article!
Now.... you always welcome comments, all comments, right?
I have a personal pet peeve for vehicles with improperly sized spares. It doesn't bother me if it's the right size and a different wheel/tire, but I just don't like it when it's not the right size. Reminds me of all the lifted jeeps you see running around with the original spare.
I'd lose the spare if it weren't going to match, just seems odd to me with all this other custom work. What about recessing it on that side somehow to make it fit better? That would match the overall build more in my mind.
Did the Willys spare match the other tires?
Just had to throw that out there, feel free (as always) to tell me where to stick it
Just a comment...
Do you have a copy of the World Cab article? I'd love to have it, I've never heard of the mag or the article!
Now.... you always welcome comments, all comments, right?
I have a personal pet peeve for vehicles with improperly sized spares. It doesn't bother me if it's the right size and a different wheel/tire, but I just don't like it when it's not the right size. Reminds me of all the lifted jeeps you see running around with the original spare.
I'd lose the spare if it weren't going to match, just seems odd to me with all this other custom work. What about recessing it on that side somehow to make it fit better? That would match the overall build more in my mind.
Did the Willys spare match the other tires?
Just had to throw that out there, feel free (as always) to tell me where to stick it
Just a comment...
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
Eric,
I will definitely plan on writing a build series for some magazine, but maybe not Vintage Trucks - they really specialize in older stuff. Maybe for jRations, they've published a bunch of my articles lately (and they've got about 4 more in their inbox from me now). I also plan to collect enough photos and data along the way to write a book on the build.
As for the spare... you know what? AEV solved the spare problem on the Brute by providing no provision for one whatsoever. I don't want to take that approach! Yes, the Willys spare was the same size as the four tires on the ground. I've got a couple of options as I see it:
- Full size spare on the bed side. The spare would stick out about 6" beyond the fender and that looks pretty strange to me. Check the earlier model photos. I suppose I could cut the bedside and recess it but I think that would be strange also. And cutting into the bed would encroach on the "4x8 plywood space" in the bed, that's my yardstick for a useful pickup.
- A swing-away carrier behind the tailgate, like the Scrambler. Really limits the usefulness of the bed - can't haul stuff with the tailgate down.
- A recess in the front of the bed, mounting the tire parallel to the front bed wall. This was the option the designer of the Summit SUT chose (a Brute lookalike kit), but that also limits the use of the bed. I want to put a bed box in for secure storage, you can see the bed box in the model photos. Can't fit both a bed box and a big spare in there.
- The space-saver spare. To me it seems like the best compromise between the look of the Willys and the desire to have a usable spare on the road. At 27", it isn't that much smaller than the 32's I'll have on the ground, and with a tire cover I doubt the average person will notice the difference. Of course, people afflicted by your pet peeve will notice it and hate it :-)
Let's see how it looks when it is built. When I get to that point I can play with full size vs. compact spare placement and we'll see. At least in model form, I think the compact spare looks ok. I am always looking for and open to comments on my design decisions... the design has gotten this far because of great input from a number people, especially on this board, so keep the comments coming! I'm sure if I start posting actual build photos I'll get lots of comments :-)
Jeff
PS: Look in your email inbox for a little present.
Jeff
I will definitely plan on writing a build series for some magazine, but maybe not Vintage Trucks - they really specialize in older stuff. Maybe for jRations, they've published a bunch of my articles lately (and they've got about 4 more in their inbox from me now). I also plan to collect enough photos and data along the way to write a book on the build.
As for the spare... you know what? AEV solved the spare problem on the Brute by providing no provision for one whatsoever. I don't want to take that approach! Yes, the Willys spare was the same size as the four tires on the ground. I've got a couple of options as I see it:
- Full size spare on the bed side. The spare would stick out about 6" beyond the fender and that looks pretty strange to me. Check the earlier model photos. I suppose I could cut the bedside and recess it but I think that would be strange also. And cutting into the bed would encroach on the "4x8 plywood space" in the bed, that's my yardstick for a useful pickup.
- A swing-away carrier behind the tailgate, like the Scrambler. Really limits the usefulness of the bed - can't haul stuff with the tailgate down.
- A recess in the front of the bed, mounting the tire parallel to the front bed wall. This was the option the designer of the Summit SUT chose (a Brute lookalike kit), but that also limits the use of the bed. I want to put a bed box in for secure storage, you can see the bed box in the model photos. Can't fit both a bed box and a big spare in there.
- The space-saver spare. To me it seems like the best compromise between the look of the Willys and the desire to have a usable spare on the road. At 27", it isn't that much smaller than the 32's I'll have on the ground, and with a tire cover I doubt the average person will notice the difference. Of course, people afflicted by your pet peeve will notice it and hate it :-)
Let's see how it looks when it is built. When I get to that point I can play with full size vs. compact spare placement and we'll see. At least in model form, I think the compact spare looks ok. I am always looking for and open to comments on my design decisions... the design has gotten this far because of great input from a number people, especially on this board, so keep the comments coming! I'm sure if I start posting actual build photos I'll get lots of comments :-)
Jeff
PS: Look in your email inbox for a little present.
Jeff
Last edited:
1x1_Speed_Craig
Simplify...
- City
- Greeneville
- State
- TN
I like the smaller spare idea. 
BTW, you should update your greatlakes4x4 thread, as well. I'm sure the guys there would love to see the updates.
Craig
BTW, you should update your greatlakes4x4 thread, as well. I'm sure the guys there would love to see the updates.Craig
trust
PITA
- City
- White Rock
- State
- NM
one thought regarding the spare tire, If you run 33x12.5s on the ground you could run a 33x9 or 33x10.5 spare, that might get your sidewall at or close to the rear fender. Of course there are several specialty sizes (p metrics 16" rims etc) that would be closer to the correct diameter but much narrower.
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
I'll be running 265/75-16 Wrangler RT/S tires, which are 32" in diameter and roughly 10.5 section width. I'm going to use them because I want a quiet road tire, not a noisy off-road tire.
The fenders will be 12" wide, but due to the angled lip of the bed which sticks out about 5", I've got 7" between the lip and the edge of the fender to fit a spare. I'd prefer not to have the spare stick out past the fender.
At about 5.5-6" wide, the T155/90D16 temp spare fits perfectly. I'm not aware of non-temp 16" wheel size tire tire that's less than about 10" wide as far as I know, so anything other than the temp would stick out.
BTW, the wider tires on the side of the bed would also interfere with the view out of the driver's door rear-view mirror, which is another reason the T-series spare is a good idea.
The fenders will be 12" wide, but due to the angled lip of the bed which sticks out about 5", I've got 7" between the lip and the edge of the fender to fit a spare. I'd prefer not to have the spare stick out past the fender.
At about 5.5-6" wide, the T155/90D16 temp spare fits perfectly. I'm not aware of non-temp 16" wheel size tire tire that's less than about 10" wide as far as I know, so anything other than the temp would stick out.
BTW, the wider tires on the side of the bed would also interfere with the view out of the driver's door rear-view mirror, which is another reason the T-series spare is a good idea.
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
1x1_Speed_Craig said:I like the smaller spare idea.
Craig
Get this... Craig starts a thread on another board, uses my photos and all of a sudden it is MY thread! :-)
Ok, Craig, I updated MY thread on greatlakes4x4 :-)
1x1_Speed_Craig
Simplify...
- City
- Greeneville
- State
- TN
jscherb said:Get this... Craig starts a thread on another board, uses my photos and all of a sudden it is MY thread! :-)
Thanks Jeff.
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
Finally got the correct tires and wheels on the model. These tires scale out to 32" and are on 16" Rubicon Moab wheels, which is what I'll have on the 1:1 pickup. The spare on the side of the bed is also now accurately scaled to match a T155/90D16. The spare in the last photo I posted was a little large because I was hacking a spare from another model kit - this one is scratch built to the exact size. That's it for the model, done.
I am now officially tired of working on the models, as I'm sure you guys are tired of looking at them. But your input has been really helpful, so thanks for the comments and thanks for bearing with me as I've gone through the revisions on the design and model.
Next week I pick up the full size tools to do the 2" lift and the 32" tires/Moab wheels on the 1:1 LJ. It will be a small start on the build at least...
Jeff
I am now officially tired of working on the models, as I'm sure you guys are tired of looking at them. But your input has been really helpful, so thanks for the comments and thanks for bearing with me as I've gone through the revisions on the design and model.
Next week I pick up the full size tools to do the 2" lift and the 32" tires/Moab wheels on the 1:1 LJ. It will be a small start on the build at least...
Jeff
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
Truck said:
Thanks, I'm glad I'm not boring you guys, or even worse, annoying you :-)
CJ-8_Jim said:So, when do you begin taking orders and deposits for building the real thing?
Definitely not, building one for money would take all the fun out of it!
-------
Sent photos of the model and final text along to Vintage Trucks Magazine today; I'll let you know when the article appears in the magazine.
I'm looking forward to tearing the LJ suspension apart and doing the lift next week, it's been a cold winter so far and I haven't spent enough time wrenching lately. Plus it will feel like I'm starting to make some actual progress towards the real build. Still will have to wait until April or so until I have an empty garage to start the real build though.
Next project after the LJ suspension I think will be installing a rear window wiper in the barn door on the back of my Scrambler World Cab - the window sure gets dirty here in the winter :-)
Jeff
jscherb
CJ-8 Member
- City
- Elmira
- State
- NY
Was cruising the Pick-n-Pull the other day and found a cool alloy wheel for the side-mounted spare for the pickup; this is a 16 x 4.5 alloy wheel from some Ford product, does anyone recognize what it's from? I don't know, it was sitting on the ground in the full-size Ford section of the yard, maybe a Crown Vic? I put a T155/90D16 tire on it - 27" diameter. It will have a tire cover on it when it is on the pickup so you won't see the tire or wheel anyway.
What's also interesting is that the stock wheel size for the original Willys pickup was 16 x 4.5, same as this, although they used a 7.00-16 tire. When I get to the point in the build where I can actually hold the spare up against the bed to check size, maybe I could go to the larger 7.00-16 size tire if I have the room. The 7.00-16 would still be narrow enough to fit well on the side of the bed.
Finished the 2" lift on the LJ yesterday, and put Rubicon Moab wheels and 32" tires on. Very nice stance now.
Now that I have the final tires and wheels I have made the measurements for the rear fenders for the pickup so I think next week I'll begin fabricating those. Will post the fender design drawing soon. (and an idea for front flares that might make Eric happy)
Jeff
What's also interesting is that the stock wheel size for the original Willys pickup was 16 x 4.5, same as this, although they used a 7.00-16 tire. When I get to the point in the build where I can actually hold the spare up against the bed to check size, maybe I could go to the larger 7.00-16 size tire if I have the room. The 7.00-16 would still be narrow enough to fit well on the side of the bed.
Finished the 2" lift on the LJ yesterday, and put Rubicon Moab wheels and 32" tires on. Very nice stance now.
Now that I have the final tires and wheels I have made the measurements for the rear fenders for the pickup so I think next week I'll begin fabricating those. Will post the fender design drawing soon. (and an idea for front flares that might make Eric happy)
Jeff
- City
- Redmond
- State
- OR
jscherb said:
Is there a part number on it? Alpha-numeric, F7TZ 12K073 B for example?
Oh...never too many pictures, this is one of the better threads I've seen...
We want LOTS of pictures of the real thing buildup.
Stouttrout
Registered Jeep Nut
- City
- Sour Lake
- State
- Tx
I can't wait to see the 1:1 scale build pics and I sure am glad to see someone more anal than i am about building something. i should my wife this thread and she said "I thought you were nuts" Hey, maybe I can buy another scrambler